Funded! This project was successfully funded on April 5, 2013.

Update #5

Updated our Journal (5): Monte Cook, Factions, Dialogue, and Companions

Hi Forgotten Ones,

I hope you had an excellent weekend.

TL;DR: More about Numenera’s setting and game rules, with video by Monte. Further explanation of Stretch Goals and funding, and what your support is making possible. Our basic plans for dialogue and companions. Unbranded wallpapers.

Numenera and the Ninth World

In this video, Monte talks about Numenera and its emphasis on mystery and discovery. He describes the Ninth World and in particular the Beyond (the region in which much of Torment will take place). Monte also talks about the basics of character creation for the tabletop game, including descriptors, foci, and the three primary character types (classes). (We’ll discuss this more in a later update, but for now know that all three character types (Glaives, Jacks, and Nanos) will be options for your PC in Torment, and that you will have (or acquire) a descriptor and focus as well.)

We are embracing the wonder and mystery of the Ninth World and it perfectly fits our goals for Torment. In some ways, Numenera iterates upon design philosophies behind Planescape™, which both Colin and Monte played key roles in creating. Monte notes: “One of the things I loved about Planescape™ was the wild imagination and the pushing the envelope – we could really do anything we wanted to, go anywhere our imaginations took us. And I wanted to achieve the same thing with Numenera.”

A key philosophy behind Monte’s new game is to allow game masters (GMs) a great degree of flexibility. Numenera provides a versatile framework within which we can play. This flexibility extends beyond the creative vision and the setting and into the game rules systems. Numenera’s rules are designed to support the narrative and creative elements of role-playing, being streamlined both to provide great variety in character customization and to keep a desirable pace for the gameplay and story. With a computer role-playing game, we can emphasize story-telling while having a more complex system underneath the hood than would be desired for a tabletop game. Computer games are capable of intricate calculations that could be tedious for tabletop play, so we're able to implement these new systems for Torment without impeding the flow of the game. Our close collaboration with Monte, means we quickly receive his feedback on our new systems. (How much of the complexity you peer into while playing will depend on your preferences – we will leverage the highly customizable user interface and extensive options system that we’ve developed for Wasteland 2 for this purpose).

One example of our extending upon the Numenera rules for Torment is our Legacy System, which along with the Tides, is not part of the core Numenera game. They are elements that inXile has designed specifically for this computer game to achieve our vision for Torment. We’ve discussed the Tides with Monte to ensure they fit well within the Ninth World, and he’s given us ideas about how to even better embrace the concept within the story and setting. As another example, we intend for Torment’s combat system to include more complexity than the core Numenera rules. One of the reasons we chose the Ninth World setting, and the Numenera rules, is because it provides an excellent foundation for Torment, with the freedom to adapt them for the best Torment computer role-playing experience we can devise.

About Stretch Goals and Funding

We’ve noted some explicit Stretch Goals, but we’ve also explained that every dollar we receive from your contributions during this campaign (including the 10% matching from $2M to $3M by @Dracogen!) will be going into the game development budget (along with reward fulfillment). I wanted to explain briefly what we mean. As more funding is available, we can make many improvements that aren’t easily described as a Stretch Goal. For example, at this upcoming milestone, George Ziets will be joining the writing team. This doesn’t just involve George. His writing contributions will allow us to increase depth and complexity, resulting in an even more branching and reactive storyline. More written content requires new art, more scripting support, and more quality assurance and iteration to polish the content. As the game increases in depth and complexity, new interface elements and features will be needed to properly communicate to you everything you need to know. George (and each writer) who contributes to the game creates more work (in a good way) for many who are behind the scenes.

Another important point to mention is the modular nature in which we’ve crafted Torment’s story. What we mean by this is that our story’s design makes it relatively easy for us to add content, especially optional content, but also critical path content in some cases. Our target funding was what we believed was required to make a worthy game that fulfills the vision we’ve presented to you. Additional resources allow us to make it richer, deeper, more polished. Though to some extent, more funds allow us to make a longer game, that is not our focus. Our focus in this regard is defined by our fourth pillar: “Reactivity, Choice, and Real Consequences.” When we talk about adding content, this is where our emphasis is: to make an even more engaging experience, to truly push the envelope in terms of role-playing game reactivity. This is one reason we’re excited about the expanding upon the Legacy System and the Tides – we see possibilities that to us were distant dreams last week when we launched this Kickstarter, when we didn’t realize how much you would support us and the vision for the game we are creating for you (and for ourselves, to be honest – this is a game we are very passionate about.)

We promise to you that all of the funds will be leveraged to best realize the vision we have presented. (Several in our community have expressed opinions along these lines, including GrinningReaper659 and aratuk.) We won’t be using funds from this Kickstarter to add in features that deviate from this vision. We treat the trust you have placed in us seriously, and will maintain our precise focus on creating the game we have told you about. (For example, there is no total this Kickstarter could reach that would lead us to implement multiplayer.) We won’t be trying to broaden our audience – our goal is to provide you with the best embodiment of the game we have presented. Any features we add, any content we add, will be to better deliver on our vision. Especially for a game like Torment, excellence is achieved through focus.

Dialogue and Companions

Compelling dialogue and intriguing companions are at the core of the Torment experience. We’ll use dialogue trees in which you choose the line you speak or the action you take from a list of options, defining your character by what you say and do. We’ll iterate on tried-and-true systems (such as that of Planescape™: Torment) to make conversations even more interesting, but we’ll target the same type of experience. We'll design a new slang unique to the world (just enough to give the world depth, mind you; we won't pound you on the head with how cool our cant is).

You’ll have optional companions who might accompany you on your journey. You will be able to talk with them, delving into their personalities and histories, even shaping them (or driving them away) with your responses. They, too, might have their own things to say about a given situation and will interject whenever they feel like it. That said, you’ll have full control over your party. Some companions might choose to leave you over an extreme situation, but as long as they’re in your party, they’ll go where you direct them and do what you tell them.

We’ve been asked some questions about what types of relationships the PC might have with their companions. Our position is this: adhering to our four pillars, we are going to craft nontraditional, complex, and believable characters. We are going to develop the companions with enough depth that we understand their motivations and personality. And then we will write them to respond appropriately to the situations they encounter. Love, which comes in many forms, is certainly relevant when exploring themes of legacy, abandonment, and mystery – and we expect to explore this emotion in ways that fits the story and characters. Meaningful friendships, even feelings of affection, will be possible, but relationships of the flesh would be inconsistent with our narrative. (Though we must admit we were amused by the Romance with Ball of Goo suggestion by billyboy. =) )

Coming Attractions

We’re closing in on our next Stretch Goal, which will mean George Ziets, a novella by Monte Cook, a new companion, and the Castoff’s Labyrinth! (Oh, and a special video from Colin...). Thanks for spreading the word and for your continued support!

This week, expect more details of our vision for Torment (including more Tales of Torment episodes), information on more frequent Stretch Goals, and more.

Miscellaneous

You may recall that we hit the character limit on our KS page. To make room for new material and updates, we’ve begun moving text from the KS page over to our tumblr site and linking to it from the KS page. So far, most of the information about the story, the gameplay, and the team has been transferred. For those who would like to learn more, there’s actually quite a wealth of information on our tumblr (including more detailed information on rewards and Stretch Goals as well as links for PS:T materials, community sites, Colin and my Formspring accounts, and more).

Per your requests, new wallpapers for the Sojourner of Worlds and Sagus Cliffs at Dawn, without the Torment logo, have been added to our website’s Media page.

Thank you for your time and have a great day,

Kevin

Comments

    1. Kkk.small

      Creator Kairam Ahmed Hamdan on March 15, 2013

      @Adam: THANKS!

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      Creator Richard Field on March 14, 2013

      I haven't got the time or patience to read through all the hundreds of comments on this update,so please be understanding if this has already been mentioned.

      What I wanted to talk about is the slang that you say will be created for Torment. Please, please, please do not use pre-existent historic or European slang words for this, as the use of words like "berk" in the tabletop Planescape setting really took me out of my immersion in that game because in Britain, a berk is a bit of an idiot. In fact most of the slang words used in tabletop Planescape sounded really off and rather naff to the English ear.
      So my plea is this...be creative and come up with cool sounding slang words of your own devising, don't take the lazy route of using historic or non-American slang words and then just re-attribute them with new meanings.

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      Creator jaakko hosioja on March 14, 2013

      A lot of comments here make a pretty good point, that in the bioware games, the romancible characters often seem rather one dimensional if you don't pursue the romance (and in some cases, even if you do).. I think implied romance or a subtle chemistry works a lot better, and will essentially leave the game and the characters just as full, even if you don't pursue it. In KoTOR, I didn't even notice that romance was an option until like the 4th playthrough, and in TSL, it never felt right to even go there; Sure if you play a chick, there's an implied chemistry with Atton, but it works better as just tension, rather than pursuing a relationship. The Handmaiden substitute, Disciple, poorly written, will fawn over the exile but I just ignore that character in general. The option to romance handmaiden or Visas with a male also seem just wrong in context of the game, but they both open up even if you don't so it doesn't really matter.

      But to be fair, Bioware didn't fuck up with all of the romancible characters in their later games; Case in point, Garrus. Even if you play a female Shep, Garrus will go through a wide and believable character arc over the 3 games, with interesting dialogue and backstory, regardless of if you pursue a romance. Perhaps because it's not an option in the first game, so they had time to establish a personality... I dunno.

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      Creator Jason Goldberg on March 13, 2013

      Anything that makes relationships with PC's and NPC"s more dynamic should be included in Torment.

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      Creator Bracken on March 13, 2013

      @Wright Johnson

      Mostly I am talking about a functionally 2D vs 3D, ie. fixed camera angle is not that much of a problem. The reason I like (functionally) 2D more is because environment shot from one angle and one angle only makes for a much better looking game, since one does not need to know what things look like from different angles. Tree leaves rustling in the wind is easy to make look believable in 2D, but not as much so when you need to animate them so that they look good from all angles. 3D models I'm okay with, since yes, that's easier to implement and actually easier to make look good in an isometric game. 3D environment, not so much.

      Another point is in gameplay and immersion, knowing that I'm already seeing everything I need to see lets me immerse myself in the game instead of rotating the camera all the time so I won't miss anything.

      And if you make a game where you can rotate the camera but never need to rotate the camera, then congratulations, you've added a redundant feature that forces you to spent much more resources.

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      Creator Mandy H on March 13, 2013

      Ah, the bottomless pit that is the Romance Debate. Thank you, InXile, for nipping that in the bud early on. Hopefully we can all move on and talk about other things now. Fantastic update, can't wait to hear more!

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      Creator Nicholas Russell on March 13, 2013

      Romance convo...

      You know what? I'm just going to completely ignore every single previous sentence in this convo and throw in my two cents. I am now really looking forward to the table top Numenera and am excited to play my new character: a psychotic gnome who bakes pies. How about you guys?

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      Creator TeknoGrief on March 13, 2013

      No romances at all thank you very much. This is looking better and better !

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      Creator Eric Schwarz on March 13, 2013

      No romances?

      Excellent.

      Themes of love and friendship and camaraderie and family are all great - but keep the fan service, soap opera drivel out. It's already worked its way up to being 50% of the development budget in BioWare games, don't make the same mistake!

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      Creator Wright Johnson on March 13, 2013

      @Bracken:

      Uh, I hate to break it to you, but this game is almost certainly going to be in 3D. I don't know how you got it in your head that it wasn't, nor do I understand why you have a problem with Wasteland 2, which will default to fixed isometric and never force you to futz with the camera. Both games are, in the main, isometric titles.

      As to why they chose to make Wasteland 2 3D instead of 2D or Project Eternity's 2D environment/3D model split, it's because 3D is infinitely more versatile, costs much less to implement, and can do fixed-perspective isometric without any of the inherent disadvantages and limitations that come from 3D assets being downscaled into 2D (which do exist, and you can read Eternity's updates for details on many of them). If that's a dealbreaker for you ( and I don't know why it would be, but I'm not you), you might want to revoke your pledge.

      That said, why are 3D graphics a problem for you, assuming a fixed-isometric camera?

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      Creator PrimeJunta on March 13, 2013

      @Bracken, hand-painted 2D done well costs more than 3D. I believe they're considering hand-painted 2D as a stretch goal. IOW, if 3D is a deal-breaker for you, I would suggest you hold until this is cleared up.

      (I would also love to see this as hand-painted isometric 2D, but I understand the constraints inXile is working under. IOW, I'll consider upping my pledge if 2D does become a stretch goal, but certainly won't lower or withdraw it if it doesn't.)

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      Creator Bracken on March 13, 2013

      This update was very much what I needed to hear. I pledged with doubts, and now they've finally evaporated. My fear was this:

      When Wasteland 2 was announced, I wasn't there. I never got to pledge. Looking back, I'm happy I didn't. Cause what they promised was another brilliant isometric game. Then they got lots of money, lots of resources. And at some point InExile realized, hey, we can do this in 3d. And had I pledged, my heart would have fallen at that point. Looking at it without pledging, I'm still disappointed, but at least it's not something I supported.

      Isometric wasn't mentioned on this update. But I wholly presume, that "We won’t be using funds from this Kickstarter to add in features that deviate from this vision" means no deviating from isometric. Because I pledged for an expensive and beautiful 2D game, not yet another 3D one.

      So, in short, thank you.

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      Creator Njall - Cayne Corp. Shareholder 6.66 on March 13, 2013

      Romancing being only sweet talking ? I think Ulysse and Penelope don't agree.

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      Creator S. Jonathon O'Donnell on March 13, 2013

      @Duskwind: The Aveline romance is kind of like the Samara romance in ME2 in a lot of ways, in that the character ultimately picks someone or something else over the PC (Donnic, her Code, respectively). Part of what makes these characters seem slightly more fleshed out is that they have something beyond the PC in their lives in a way some of the others don't (Fenris, for example,who doesn't seem to have much of anything going on). The issue is really that Aveline comes across as a human being while the other 'fuller' romances come across as a list of issues for Hawke to (attempt to) fix (and fail to, in at least one rather important case), because their personalities were constructed around them being romance options and thus their foibles were crafted to facilitate that.

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      Creator Mirved on March 13, 2013

      Tbh i've never found romances to be interesting. Romancing pixels does nothing to me. I play games to experience epic adventures and great stories. Not to sweet talk some random female npc.

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      Creator Angi Spri on March 13, 2013

      I tihink the romance in PST was perfect. If Torment goes the same route I will be happy...

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      Creator Nietsewitch on March 13, 2013

      Screw the damn romance, screw it all. Or at least give me a switch. "TO SKIP IT ALL"-Romancebutton would be a possibility.

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      Creator Gasmaskangel on March 12, 2013

      A thought occurs, you mention in this post that followers may leave the PC in extreme circumstances, and usually in RPGs that means you've cheesed them off in some way, usually by not strictly adhering to their personal moral code or them just not liking you or something along those lines. What if a follower left because they liked you? It could be because events have destroyed their belief in themselves as anything other than a good person and view their friendship as poisonous, or that they don't know how to cope with this hu-man emotion called love, but either way I don't a companion leaving because they're scared of what might happen if they get too close to someone has ever been attempted before.

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      Creator Gene on March 12, 2013

      Devs are wise to step away from the Bioware formula, it's time for good writing to prevail and allow a greater breadth of personalities and interactions. With any luck abandonment will be one of the themes to play out in these interactions as well.

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      Creator Mattias Thorén on March 12, 2013

      Let us have relationships of the flesh! Just make it deep and meaningfull.

    21. Fb_profile_picture.small

      Creator Chris Newton on March 12, 2013

      Honestly, I think most romance in roleplaying games to be sterile and leaves nothing to the imagination. All they usually turn out to be is rattling off obvious dialogue choices or doing a sidequest. The pay off being slightly changed dialogue at minor points in the game and a clumsy scene where both characters embrace in their underpants and fade to black.

      I don't believe that's any more engaging than leaving it the player to come to their own conclusion through subtext and not having to explicitly make it a thing that has to happen in game. But I value when a game gives you more to think and talk about instead of "hey bro did you pick computer girlfriend a, b, or c?"

      Sometimes things that aren't said or defined leave stronger impressions than things mechanically codified. At least, that's how I see it.

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      Creator volcatius on March 12, 2013

      I have to admit that i always liked the romances in Bioware's games (with the exception of Dragon Age 2 which disappointed me in many ways).

      Given the nature of a game like Torment, i would definately welcome romance options.

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      Creator Kevin M. Heinrich on March 12, 2013

      I have to say, I like that the characters are being really developed, with complex narratives, goals, and motivations. I am disappointed in that romances are not an option. If feel romance and love is a vital part and experience in epic RPG's like this. You don't have to make an in your face overtly sexual relationship if it doesn't fit with the story, but it would lacking in my opinion without at least some of this. Also, I'm a pervert, so if we could get "relationships of flesh" it would REALLY push me to find some way of increasing my pledge. ;-)

    24. Duskwind.small

      Creator Duskwind (Exile in Torment) on March 12, 2013

      @SBS "Someone should just launch a romance-centric isometric RPG on Kickstarter; the demand is clearly there ;)" - I don't think it is. The demand is for story-centric RPGs with highly interactive NPCs as one element of the game. We want companions to be characters who can relate to the PC in a variety of different ways based on your choices and make a difference to the story, not combat drones with a backstory to unlock a paragraph at a time. Giving companions a single development path you can succeed or fail with is bad irrespective of whether that path is a romance or a friendship or a gradual descent into mortal enmity. And if there are multiple ways to relate to a companion, ruling romance out seems strange.

      @S. Jonathon O'Donnell - actually the Aveline romance is great, aside from the complete lack of resolution (she picks someone else over the PC, which is fine, but there's no acknowledgement of her turning the PC down, which isn't).

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      Creator Kamos | Exile in Torment on March 12, 2013

      @Abnaxis
      As a member of the backlash group, I must say your argument is very reasonable. :-)

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      Creator Abnaxis on March 12, 2013

      I would second a lot of other backers on here showing concern for the stance on romances. Nothing is more important to legacy than the people we leave behind, and the relationships we build with them. Leaving out intimate relations (or, more likely, leaving them at the "we love each other but it would never work" stage, like in PS:T) effectively excludes a large swath of the themes T:TON is built to explore.

      I understand that there is a lot of backlash against the Bioware style of romance, but remember that romance doesn't actually fit withing the narratives Bioware builds. It doesn't make sense to boink your subordinates in the middle of a Hero's Journey to save the galaxy; it's just included for fanservice. On the other hand, ina game whose central theme is "What does one life matter?" it is a missed opportunity if you consciously avoid exploring intimate relations in a narrative and thematically appropriate context.

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      Creator TheChosenOne on March 12, 2013

      Yea, I wouldn't mind optional side love conquering or silly princess relations. As long as it fits the game go for it. I don't even mind how far. Something for all I always say.

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      Creator Cipher- Weaver of lost dreams on March 12, 2013

      I've been watching some of montes gencon videos on the setting and I have to say it reminds me of tecknomagic. And ateptus macanacus cult from warhammer 40k. Which made me wonder about the sire sion dynamic. Is it a kin to genetic memory in which you have the skill instinctively but don't know how or why it works? Also does it leave a genetic marker which could unlock potential thats potentially harmful the more you tap in to it? Just some thoughts i had last night and i wanted to get them out while i remembered.

    29. Missing_small

      Creator Gyges on March 12, 2013

      "Pushing the envelope"? I'm a proud backer but renaming and using the holy trinity of classes and a vague questionnaire to determine class isn't innovative. At least mix it up with the Nano (mage) and put in some exotic "elements". Instead of lightning, fire or ice put in spacial disruptions, psychokinetics or dimensional manipulation.
      And romances like in Planescape would be great, it adds another unknown layer, a new dimension to a companion, which is one of the things that makes me replay a game.

    30. Missing_small

      Creator Wright Johnson on March 12, 2013

      @Ricardo:

      Oh, don't worry about it. I wasn't annoyed or anything. I just wanted to clear up any potential confusion about my position on the matter.

      And yes, you may call me Wright. Or Ffordesoon, if you feel more comfortable using my preferred online sobriquet. Or Fford.

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      Creator Justin Woo on March 12, 2013

      Also, if it wasn't clear enough in my post, mini-game sex is NOT what I'm after. I'm after beautiful, heartbreaking romance. I know that *my* life wouldn't matter without my wife. Sex scenes, if they happen at all, should take place during "fade to black" sequences in 2D isometric games anyhow.

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      Creator Justin Woo on March 12, 2013

      I must say I'm kind of disappointed that there won't be romances in this game. One of my favorite parts of PS:T was the love triangle between the Nameless One, Annah, and Falls-From-Grace. Over ten years later, and I STILL haven't decided whom I loved more, and could STILL go either way.

      My biggest journey in my life is my marriage. It's only just begun and it's already defining me and educating me in ways that would never have been possible if I wasn't married. Why can't The Forgotten One be educated and defined in the same way? If the question is "What does one life matter?" then why doesn't romantic love come into the equation?

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      Creator Cipher- Weaver of lost dreams on March 12, 2013

      Addendum asking if a concept has been considered and how it might work given we know next to nothing about how the world works is not the same as saying "i want/demand x be added as a feature".

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      Creator Darth Trethon-Obsidian Order +WoOS & EiT on March 12, 2013

      Can people just stop complaining about romances already....they are a key aspect of the human emotional spectrum and one of the largest influences on our lives regardless if that would be our own romances or of those around us plus the little insignificant you wouldn't be alive if your parents didn't have one. With that being said a game like this that is all about story and meaning and exploration it just wouldn't be right to ignore an issue of such significance......the question the game explores is "What does one life matter?" and ultimately the worth of a life cannot be measured by ignoring the main reason life exists in the first place.

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      Creator Cipher- Weaver of lost dreams on March 12, 2013

      when i made my original comment on the update I did not intend to cause such chaos. Torment is about confronting philosophical questions and allowing the player to seek their own answers and end up with more questions. Few things in life are absolute. I actual find the polarized discord disappointing as it misses a wider point.

    36. Fb_profile_picture.small

      Creator Ricardo Alves Junqueira Penteado on March 12, 2013

      @Wright (mind if I call you Wright? I'm going to call you Wright),

      I'm sorry i the way I presented my arguments made it look as if you were "choosing a side", as it were. It was no my intention. As I mentioned on my comment, I was pasting my arguments from a discussion on another part of the Torment community.

      in that discussion, posters were being much more aggressive towards romance in the game, a posture I found utterly baffling. As such, I presented more aggressive arguments in response. After I pasted my comment, I read your arguments, and found the need to "back" them, as it were, as they were presented in a much more neutral way than mine, and were closer to my original intent.

      My interest, as I believe I mentioned, as not in seeing "sci fantasy porn", as I understand some fans are concerned, or just a Mary Suesque desire to be able to acquire achievements for banging every NPC. Sure, it was fun as hell to do in Fallout 2 (kama sutra master!), but I don't believe that is the purpose of Torment.

      I just don't see how a meaningful game, dealing in a mature way about relationships, can do so without allowing for the possibility of romance and sex.

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      Creator silvercross on March 12, 2013

      @Wright Johnson lol, I read your comment in a Minsc voice. (Like that line "Swords! Not words!")

      Thanks to InXile for addressing the issue of companions and "romances." Everyone has seems to have such a hate-on for romances, but I find that highly relevant for game about one's personal journey. There are many kinds of love out there and so many themes that could be explored on top of that (forbidden love, cold/passionate love, betrayal etc.) . I would find it odd, inhuman even, if someone has never loved.

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      Creator Silver on March 12, 2013

      Great update, keep 'em coming! :)

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      Creator David on March 12, 2013

      I really like the straight forward character system offered by the Numenera setting. It fits Torment's focus on narrative just beautiful. I'm hoping there will also be many more "text-descriptive means" similar to this for the character creation in the final game.
      Oh, and I support you on your decision to not having any fleshy humping. If it doesn't fit, then that's that. Shoehorning it in just to "prove" something, for someone, or whatever ain't flying either.

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      Creator Darth Trethon-Obsidian Order +WoOS & EiT on March 12, 2013

      I was doing my usual incessant compare and contrast in tiers as I am considering a second major upgrade when I noticed the 2.5 mil stretch goal has been marked as achieved and the Kickstarter will touch it really soon...this makes me hope for an update...yes I know I am extremely unreasonable to expect daily updates but I can't help it.....it's just too awesome and I end up spending hours just watching the numbers move and reading everything over again as I dig for missed details and such.

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      Creator Moorindal on March 12, 2013

      Awesome update. Can't wait for the next one.

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      Creator PrimeJunta on March 12, 2013

      Why not throw in a player house as well? Need that to raise the babies. Add in some microtransactions for furnishing it, with an option of a lovely tomb in the basement, and we've got a certain moneymaker.

      Then rename it Torment: The Sims of Numenéra.

      On second thought, maybe not.

    43. Missing_small

      Creator Wright Johnson on March 12, 2013

      UGH, WORDS, NOT "WORRDS"

      STUPID HANDS

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      Creator Wright Johnson on March 12, 2013

      @Ricardo:

      While I'm pleased that you liked what I wrote, I do feel duty-bound to point out that I am not supporting either "side" in this discussion, and your paraphrase (assuming it is indeed a paraphrase) is ambiguous enough that it puts worrds in my mouth.

      My only point is that I understand the potential of romance as a narrative device, and thus am saddened by the current state of affairs in the medium and the genre. I don't necessarily believe Torment is the game to deliver on the potential of that device, but neither am I strictly opposed to it. I am romance-agnostic, as it were, and am thus on the developers' side no matter which way they want to go. I believe them when they say it doesn't fit within the story they're telling.

      I will say, however, that I do share others' befuddlement at the idea that "relationships of the flesh" are outside the scope of a story about the legacy we leave behind us. I don't care if it's in the game or not, but it does seem a bit of an odd choice considering the themes of the narrative. Then again, they may feel that the creator/creation relationship between the Last Castoff and his or her progenitor is enough of a metaphorical tie to the relationship between parent and child for the purposes of their narrative that they don't need a literal parent/child relationship.

      There are likely other, more practical concerns at play as well, of course; proper implementation of a parent/child dynamic could be very costly, and it would be a poor use of their time to implement the needed reactivity at the expense of more plot-relevant areas of the game. None of which is to be interpreted as, "If you give them enough money, they will put procreation in."

    45. Bola13_msn.small

      Creator Kamos | Exile in Torment on March 12, 2013

      @Macha

      You've really decided you just want to insult me. So yeah, whatever you say.

    46. Fb_profile_picture.small

      Creator TeknoGrief on March 12, 2013

      99,9% excellent update!! You made my day !
      theres that 0,1% though "Meaningful friendships, even feelings of affection, will be possible"
      Ill be keeping a very angry eye on this
      Other than that MAKE THIS GAME HAPPEN . My body is ready !

    47. Fb_profile_picture.small

      Creator Gundersun on March 12, 2013

      Of course this just begs the question of why it would be inconsistent with the narrative...

    48. Db_great_white221.small

      Creator Nameless Knightshark on March 12, 2013

      So now you are asking that the devs include and confirm that the PC can procreate? Why not just leave the discussion and trust the devs to do it as they want? Why do you still talk about this topic in terms of checklists? I think the information "true love" below was too much already.

    49. Just_say_no.small

      Creator undecaf on March 12, 2013

      The comments section is becoming increasingly unbearable to read.... What happened in the world all of a suddent that - in a cRPG; in every cRPG - romance, rather than gameplay, presentation or story quirks is the most sought after feature and its possible (likely?) exclusion being so controversal that there is practically nothing more to talk about, and the cause for people flailing all around? I'm just waiting for the inevitable "I will withdraw my 20 dollars if I can't romance my buddies in the game, take that InXile!" -ultimatums. Please let it go people, the loss of "LI's" does not break the game.

    50. Fb_profile_picture.small

      Creator Ricardo Alves Junqueira Penteado on March 12, 2013

      Reading the comments below I've seen a great tendency from players, to note the shallowness of most current games relationships, arguments much more mature than those made elsewhere.

      I believe Wright Johnson said it best in the comments: we believe romance is important, not what passes for it in most games. And we believe you, with this game, have the chance to pay it proper respect.

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