by inXile entertainment
Uhhh... We're gonna need more stretch goals soon. I vote for more companions... I know that since they're going to be so well written we can't have tons of them, but 5 seems so few. I want enough I have to play through multiple times to experience them all.
Agreed, more stretch goals!
It's set in our future man. A billion years in the future but still...
I understand how some people may see the stretch goals we see now (1.2, 1.5 and 2) as boring, but to me, they show how deeply inXile understands what Torment is supposed to be about.
Unlike WL2 or P:E, Torment cannot benefit from "5 new character classes", "uberdungeon with 100 levels". Torment will benefit from upgrades that increase its depth and immersion, not only its scope. Adding a female option will probably greatly increase immersion for many players, and add some variety to others, which makes it a great stretch goal. Expanding the creative potential of the team in other stretch goals isn't as satisfying as the standard hype-generating stretch goal, but at least to me, it seems like the right way to go.
I keep coming back to this page just to have another look... there's just something really compelling about the concept art. I'm in love with the design of the female PC... really hope the final version will be similar to this.
@inXile Don't listen too much to the comments here please, I trust you to do a proper spiritual successor so don't let other's opinions intefere.
I'd love to see another digital pack between $125 and $350....hard to explain exactly why but I seem far more attracted to the digital packs of this project.
@Jan Vančura - Please see what I wrote. I'm glad we have a gender option. It just doesn't seem like there is much value in how these stretch goals cost compared to what is being added.
If Obsidian was able to add an entire region, a new companion and translations into 4 new languages for $200k total, then why are these stretch goals so expensive?
"And there were characters the player interacted with who were sexist, and others who were more virtuous. If Dragon Age 2 had opted to tip-toe around issues of sexism, homosexuality and a number of other controversial and polarizing subjects, do you think the depth of choice and the believability of the characters in the world would have suffered?"
Dragon Age 2 was awful. I hope I see nothing of DA2 in this game.
Hey, YOU. Yes, you! If you haven't yet done it, get to the forum (http://torment.uservoice.com/) and vote on a few stretch goals. Or suggest one. They are at the "Torment Kickstarter" menu, just set the filter to "stretch goals". Thanks. :-)
@mr Ermac I agree
So many knickers in twists.
Losing my faith in humanity over here (both male and female members).
Thanks for the link! I think it'll be good to share such insights on Numenera with all ppl here to get rid of unwanted speculations.
Do we have to tell you or do something to get the Torment+PEternity reward?
At this rate you might have to start considering a 10M stretch goal... :)
I backed this project, without knowing much, for my husband. It sounded like he would sell his firstborn for Wasteland, so I figured we might get rid of the other kid here (ha ha). His response was meh, but I find myself getting quite excited. I'm glad that combat is not really required. I'm glad the player character can be female (I can't believe that that wasn't the case from the word "go", but I will ignore that). I wish she was not quite so skinny, but I'm glad that she doesn't have ridiculous breasts. Can she have some hair, please, or will we be able to customize things like that? I'm not sure that I should be glad about a game that will force me to buy a new computer and will suck away all my free time, but so be it.
Where is the Pat Rothfuss stretch goal?
@mr Ermac - Dragon Age 1 and 2 both had interesting themes, even if Dragon Age 2 had some major flaws (repeating areas, removing player choice, over-simplification of game concepts).
It has been mentioned bellow that you just have to be a backer of either project. If you're commenting here, you're going to get it.
Really not a fan of playing specific characters (well, in rpgs.. and I never finished Planescape), but it's mighty cool that we can pick female PC. Kudos!
@DiabolicallyRandom. Great news :D I'll get on that. Right now :D
Did we break KS? My previous comment isn't showing. The dollar amount hasn't grown in some time. I upped my pledge and the dollar mark still didn't change.
@Adam Heine. Ahh thanks. I'd understood "backers of torment and eternity" (ie people who backed both" rather than "backers of torment AND backers of eternity" (ie. people who backed either.
@DiabolicallyRandom That great to know :D I've backed it now.
@Julia Gosztyla Ziobro: Yeah, a lot of people thought it was strange that the main character couldn't be female in Planescape: Torment too. But if you play that game, I'm sure you'll quickly understand why - supporting both genders in a story as hugely expansive as P:T's would've been a labor of Hercules.
HAHA, ran out again because of the limit. You guys keep exceeding Kickstarters barriers. :)
My suggestion, stop thinking of stretch goals, start working on the game. Dec 2014, that's like less than 2 years from now, I don't want an unfinished KotoR 2 again.
@IamHowie - From what I understand, KOTOR 2 had about 9 months of production. And while you're doing production on a title for a publisher, you spend a bunch of time doing milestones and repeatedly justifying why your project shouldn't be cancelled.
LucasArts as it was then actually went bankrupt and folded. They shipped KOTOR 2 unfinished, scrapped KOTOR 3, Battlefield 3 and closed their doors. They re-opened inside of ILM offices later as a new LucasArts.
2 years should be plenty of time for this game, especially without publisher interference.
Wow, this gender role and sexism discussion is a funny thing. As far as my opinion goes, why can't people acknowledge the fact that women and men ARE different, without being called sexist? Recognizing that as a general rule we have different methods of communication, physical and mental gifts, as well as needs should be approached as a general understanding, and not something negative. If the designers want to shape the storyline to have alternate solutions based on these principles, then I call that good writing and game design.
As this modern era blurs gender roles, we see more and more women being subjected to pressure at their jobs, particularly if they want to have children. Should a pregnant woman have to log in as many hours as her male counterparts or skip maternity leave to fit our "equal" world? How about we treat each other fairly, and embrace what makes us different!
@John Paul Selwood - It is a fine line. The depiction of a single character can be seen as a statement on all men or women, in the same way that anytime a minority plays a villain in a film people interpret as a saying all minorities are inherently evil.
If you portrayed a female character for example that sought validation because she had a crisis of faith, then someone will say you're implying all females lack in confidence and strength, even if you're simply trying to tell the story of a single character.
Whats the next stretch goal after $2m????? Because you're going to hit it no problems at this rate!
Why do you think that the main protagonist was not female from the beginning? The whole discussion is kind of stupid. The sex is irrelevant in this game, it's about life and death, legacy and the impact of our own decisions through the lifetime. It's not about flowers and butterflies, boys and girls, we have real shit here.
I reckon the default character was going to be female and they've just given us the ability to pick male, otherwise why would they have a female concept art ready so fast and no male one yet?
I reckon the default character was going to be female and they've just given us the ability to pick a male, otherwise why would they have a female concept art ready so fast and no male one yrt?
$125 down, and it feels good, man. It feels good.
@Brumfield - No. 2 years is not plenty of time for a game with this promised size. It's a very tight schedule if they just started. Considering all the designing process, testing, reimplementation if it didn't work, resource coordination, that could take many many months. A minor branch in the sea of program codes could lead to disasterous result with very few hints to trace back to its source. Which could lead to another few months of delay.
But, inExile is made up of very experienced designers, with this amount of fundings, maybe they could recruit more resources in the way. It is still a very challenging attempt in my opinion. Adding a block of text is nothing comparing to adding a line of code in a program. You can ask a writer to add 10 lines of scripts and be done in 1 hour, which could lead to 1 week of overnight works for 10 programmers to code them in with solid integrity.
I don't think they have given us a female option, I think they've given us a male option, they already had female concept art ready, but no male
ahhh my comments are appearing now, weren't working a minute ago...
Let's try a thought experiment:
"Oh man, I hate this main character, he's all ugly and has too many scars."
We're basically talking about two player characters here, probably with a lot in common, but with some divergence to account for how the setting treats their gender. So yeah, there's a fair bit of work to make sure that none of the scenes are broken by thinking about only one of the variations on the character, but as openly discussed, not $300'000.
As an actual game dev, I'd be happy if inExile spent every dollar over the asking price on iteration, polishing and QA.
@IamHowie - Project of this size? We don't know how long the game will be yet. And they aren't just starting. Many of these guys have been kicking around ideas for 10 years. We know from Colin that they've actually been hashing out design/pre-production for months already.
Wasteland 2 is getting about 18 months total for development, the same with Project Eternity. 2 years will be fine.
You got that right. The funny thing is that there are many possibilities opened with this addition. Imagine a cult deditated to a God or a Goddess, with the priests being of that deity's sex only, and have them react differently to different PCs. Or you could have a group of people who kill 9 out of 10 babies of one gender and have the survivors work as slaves for the others, who will react differently to your PC. The latter is obviously horrifying, whereas the former is just shrug worthy.
The point is, there can be misogynists, misandrists, people who don't care, and anything in between. It's just more branching and possibilities. It's doesn't have to be one monolithic structure, and the only ones who seem stuck in the "sexist uniform world - battle of the sexes" paradigm are the ones who complain the loudest about it. For the rest of us this is whole thing has been quite perplexing, and more than a bit amusing.
Looks like we're gonna need another Stretch Goal!
throw in a Magic 8-ball full of crew hints & in-jokes!
@Eric - Fair enough
looks to me like we need some more stretch goals! So Happy for InXile!
At some point, InXile's Kickstarter updates will finally manage to catch up to their current funding. Until that time, I'm just going to sit here in the corner and snicker. )
Given that they already have a female PC sketched up but not a male one I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the game was orriginally intended for a female protag, and the alt protag is the male one.
@IamHowie: inXile won't deliver a broken game because they're not dealing w/ publishers, they are dealing w/ supporters. It's a safe bet that in case they need more time to finish the project the vast majority of backers will understand and keep supporting them. I know I would. Besides, stretch goals are important to bring more money to the project
Dear InXile, please supply us with another stretch goal to annihilate. Chop-chop, we haven't got all day. :P
It's pretty amazing that a female protagonist wasn't considered from the beginning. This isn't the '90s and we can't pretend that women don't play games anymore. She looks a tad... rough, too. Lacking detail and half blended into the scenery there. Maybe she was originally planned as a party member rather than a protagonist? She certainly fits the setting though and goes against the typical tropes. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you do with her.
@Velijan: I actually suspect it might actually be the other way around. The fact they already had artwork for a female protagonist but not a male one suggests to me a high possibility that the default protagonist was going to be female if the stretch goal was not attained. Additionally, If one looks at the statuette for the First Castoff, you can make out the slight curvature of breasts in the chest area (as well as the more obvious feminine mask) which seems to imply that the First Castoff was/is a woman (and thus the Last Castoff also being female sets up a certain symmetry).
Regardless, we will be getting the choice, so it doesn't really matter.