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A story-driven CRPG set in the world of Monte Cook's Numenera.  We are deeply appreciative to all of you who made this possible.
A story-driven CRPG set in the world of Monte Cook's Numenera.  We are deeply appreciative to all of you who made this possible. Torment: Tides of Numenera is available now for PC on Steam or GOG, as well as PlayStation 4 and Xbox One.
A story-driven CRPG set in the world of Monte Cook's Numenera. We are deeply appreciative to all of you who made this possible. Torment: Tides of Numenera is available now for PC on Steam or GOG, as well as PlayStation 4 and Xbox One.
74,405 backers pledged $4,188,927 to help bring this project to life.

Updated Our Journal (53): Beta Test is Live!

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tl;dr: Beta test released, companions with Colin, IGN stream

Hello everyone,

Chris Keenan here!

Today we are absolutely thrilled to announce that the Torment: Tides of Numenera beta test is now available to all applicable backers! This also brings what is likely to be the final part of the Road to Beta series of updates, though we will of course be sharing more details with you going forward throughout development.

The Sorrow: Circle-breaker, Soultaker, the shadow of your doom.
The Sorrow: Circle-breaker, Soultaker, the shadow of your doom.

If you pledged at a level which comes with beta test access, you can get your Steam key by logging in with your Torment account, visiting the Rewards page, and clicking the "Manage Keys" button you see there.

While your beta test downloads, please be sure to check out our Beta Release Notes, which covers some known issues and contains notes on a few game features. And remember, the Beta Test Access add-on is still available to all backers who want to join in and experience the game first-hand before final release.

A Free Gift for Beta Backers

You may remember that acclaimed author Pat Rothfuss offered to write a Torment comic book. We are happy to announce that not only is it finished, but we are also making it available free to all of our previous Torment beta backers at no additional charge. You can check out your Rewards page on the Torment backer web site to download it right now (click the "Downloads" button on your reward that includes your beta key).

Note: If you are a backer who pledged separately to get the Pat Rothfuss comic as an add-on, you can use the "Remove Reward" button on the add-on to get your pledge value back and use it towards other add-ons of your choice. 

Introducing… the Companions

One of the defining elements in the original Planescape: Torment wasn't just its weird and wondrous world, but also its characters. Players remember many of the game's companions today for good reason, and with Torment: Tides of Numenera we are hoping to create deep, nuanced and interesting characters who you will be able to connect with, and in some cases, change.

Previously, we have been a little quiet on sharing our characters with you, in large part to avoid spoiling them. However, with the beta release now available, we thought it was an ideal time to introduce a few.

I'll be turning things over to Colin to give you a quick bio on some of the fine folks you can expect to journey with while exploring Sagus Cliffs. Of course, this isn't a full list of companions in the final game – it's not even a full list of companions in the beta.

As a warning, there are spoilers contained below, but nothing that will go beyond what you will see in the beta.

Aligern

Aligern is one of the first companions the Last Castoff will meet. He's a snappish, world-weary nano who doesn't suffer fools or waste time on matters he considers trivial. Despite this rough exterior, Aligern has a deep moral core, and his innate sense of right and wrong guides every decision – and he's not shy about letting others know when they've stepped out of line.

Aligern wears a long, dark coat and rugged traveling boots that have worn countless miles under their soles. As a nano, he's got extensive experience with the numenera. He wears a lattice of moving tattoos across his forearms that shift and weave around each other, which he can use to attack his enemies or to defend himself against attacks. Unlike some other nanos, he's not afraid to get his hands bloody, wading into melee combining useful esoteries with his trusty mace.

Callistege

As the Last Castoff wakes to consciousness, Callistege is there, watching, calculating. She's an associate of the Order of Truth, and she holds the accruement of knowledge as one of the paramount pursuits. She is known to be amoral, calculating, and manipulative, and she has cultivated a reputation for incisive brutality. Those who know her do not cross her, and some have suggested that this is precisely the outcome she was aiming to achieve. She is morally flexible in her pursuit of hidden truth.

And she does seem to have found secrets better left hidden. She is multi-dimensional... literally. Echoes of her flicker in and out of reality around her. Each of these "sisters" wears her signature elaborate dress, mirroring her actions, deviating in ways both subtle and obvious. In battle, she fights with a mix of nano abilities and ranged attacks, and is able to use her sisters to "teleport" herself from place to place to avoid taking damage.

Callistege's response to the Last Castoff is more outwardly sympathetic, encouraging the Last Castoff to experience and learn from the world... but those who know her would suspect her all the more because of this. What are her motives?

Tybir

Tybir is a glad-handing and garrulous old mercenary, quick with a joke and an offer to buy the next round. He has stories to tell, having served as both soldier and gallowglass, and he's frequently the life of the party. He's always looking for fresh opportunities for profit, fame, and fun... not necessarily in that order.

Tybir wears the practical clothes of a soldier, but in garish colors – a long leather coat, baggy pants, open shirt and belted equipment, all with a casual flair. He's handsome, and many have found him charming, but now that he's older, more dissipated, and thicker around the waist, his charm seems to be slipping away from him. He favors the simpler tools of a soldier in combat, but he's never far from using a dirty trick or insult to even the odds.

With the Last Castoff, Tybir is friendly, outgoing, and eager to please. This might have something to do with the imminent execution of Tybir's most recent associate...

Colin out.

5 Million Dollars, IGN Streams Torment & Hero's Song

Interest in Torment's beta test has been huge, and we have now crested $5 million in pledges! Seeing that was a big moment for us, and a fresh reminder that we could never do this without your support along the way. Thank you once again!

Next, for those of you who are holding off on the beta, IGN was kind enough to sit down with Brian and George yesterday afternoon to demo the first hour of the game.

This video is not spoiler-free, but gives you a good idea of what you can expect to see out of the beta content.

Last, we'd be remiss without giving a quick shout-out to the new Kickstarter title Hero's Song. Developed by Pixelmage Games, a veteran team with experience on several RPGs including EverQuest and Shadowrun, Hero's Song is a hardcore action-RPG with pixel-style graphics. Importantly, the award-winning author Patrick Rothfuss is lending his considerable talents to Hero's Song (in addition to his work on Torment, of course). They are just out of the gate and could use the help reaching their $800,000 goal.

Once again, thank you for joining us and for helping make Torment possible. Your group of game developers on the Torment team have poured the last few years of their lives into creating an incredibly special and memorable world for you to explore. The passion exhibited along the way can be felt in the characters, the setting, and the overall experience.

And it's only going to get better from here…

We'll see you next time!

Chris Keenan

Comments

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    1. Atlictoatl on

      I'd like to get a refund for my $50 pledge. How do I do that?

      The game is years late on expected release. That might be understandable, but I'd expect some clarity re: timeline, since the project is late.

      My $50 pledge included some extras. Even if the final game is late, I should have received those extras in the last three years. I haven't. That's a violation of good faith.

      I didn't pay for Beta access. I'm not especially interested in Beta access. Still, had I been given a Beta key because of the extreme delay in releasing this product I helped to fund, I'd be more amenable to sticking it out and waiting for this product. Not doing so shows significant disrespect for the KS backers of this game.

      Beta could have been released first to those who paid for it, then all KS backers as an apology for being so late and an incitement of renewed enthusiasm, then added to Steam Early Access with a message to KS backers about that so we understand why it was needed. Instead, KS backers are slapped in the face.

      No game delivered...
      No extra rewards delivered...
      Being excluded from Early Access because the money I paid 35 months ago "didn't include it"...

      Please contact me about my refund.

    2. Roger van Velzen on

      Hmm interesting. It seems my $95 pledge did not get me beta access while a lower tier does give that?

    3. BlackGauntlet
      Superbacker
      on

      @Helena - Yea, play-testing shmay-smesting, you and me both. as for viewing us as numbers, InXile did come out to say that it's their business model to get money here to have something made then get money on Steam Early Access to have it finished - that we are part of said model means that we ARE numbers to them.

      Of course it makes economical sense but I really hope they could be more sensitive about it in that backers throw in not just money but trust and loyalty as well. Those are stuff you can't buy from Steam Early Accessers (most probably aren't even old enough to sit on a chair to play Planescape: Torment when it first came out).

      I believe the ire could have been easily deflected when InXile put it on Early Access that the game is still in BETA because nowhere on Steam's page (http://store.steampowered.com/app/272270/) did it point that out. Pretty klutzy if you ask me.

    4. Helena on

      @ Lim: Ah, OK. When you mentioned a 'closed beta' I thought you were talking about a separate build or something, not just those few days before it went up on Early Access.
      - Early Access refunds: I'm just going by what it says on Steam's website (don't use Steam myself, so I can't speak from personal experience). It did say that you could still ask for refunds after that period, just that you're not guaranteed to get one. Come to that, anyone who's really pissed off with inXile could probably get a refund as well - I think they refunded a few people over the 'turn-based vs. RTwP' issue when they kicked up a fuss.
      - I don't think inXile view us as 'just numbers', though without being a mind-reader I obviously can't provide any proof. To be fair to them, their whole reason for coming to Kickstarter in the first place was to get funding - free publicity and a loyal fanbase are useful side benefits, but not the main purpose. And I'm pretty sure they are spending most of the extra funds to improve the game itself, not just sitting there cackling on their huge piles of money.

      I do understand why some people enjoy play-testing early versions of games, even though it doesn't appeal to me personally. What I find much harder to understand is why people who never pledged for beta access in the first place, therefore presumably didn't want it, are now getting upset becuase they see that other people have it when they don't. It seems like a rather petty 'dog-in-the-manger' attitude to me.

    5. BlackGauntlet
      Superbacker
      on

      @Helena - Glad you're schooled in that. At least we can speak on equal grounds. So, anyway...
      - "And even if they had been, the beta *was* released to the backers a week earlier, as you yourself pointed out - so what promise has been broken here?" Nothing there. Just pointing out to you that you either didn't put the same thing across earlier or missed out on that.
      - I've refunded some Early Access games, actually. Have there been a change in Steam's Refund Policy lately?
      - I *know* it's not about dollars and cents but it's InXile who did not. That's what I'm trying to put across earlier, that we are now just numbers to them; as are those who paid for the Early Access.

      I personally do not want to participate in play-testing for bugs without getting paid but I do empathize with those who, had a hand in making this game possible, do.

    6. Helena on

      @ Lim Yeow Seng: No need for the basic Economics courses, thanks - I studied economics at university and work as an accountant, so I'm quite familiar with concepts like opportunity cost and the time value of money. To address your specific points:

      - Regarding the beta release, the devs were saying that beta-level backers would get access to the beta before the full game was completed and put on sale. They can't have been planning an Early Access beta release at that point, as Steam EA didn't exist at the time the campaign was created. And even if they had been, the beta *was* released to the backers a week earlier, as you yourself pointed out - so what promise has been broken here?

      - Early Access games are not refundable 'at any time' - the refund window is 2 weeks after purchase, and you can't have played the game for more than 2 hours.

      - Regarding interest, you're technically correct, but if that extra $1 really means that much to you then I can't imagine why you'd back a game through Kickstarter in the first place. Your hypothetical dumb banker certainly wouldn't - not only does he forego the chance to earn interest, but it's far more risky than just waiting until the game is released, since it might be cancelled or turn out to be not what he'd hoped. (In fact, even Early Access is riskier, so he probably wouldn't do that either.) Then there's the effect of inflation, which means that the Early Access buyers are paying slightly less in real terms than someone who backed the Kickstarter.

      Pledging to KS makes no economic sense whatsoever, but the point is that it's not *about* economics - it's about helping to create a product that didn't exist previously, and wouldn't exist at all unless people pledged for it. Kickstarter explicitly makes this point in their FAQ, and so did you in your last post. I backed the project on that basis, I assume you did as well, so why is the financial aspect suddenly so important? Especially when it's always been possible for late backers to pledge through the website anyway?

      In all the fuss over the beta and Early Access, I've yet to see one person explain what, specifically, inXile have done wrong or how they've actually broken any promises. It seems to come down to a vague feeling that backers should be somehow 'special', and the devs aren't making them feel special enough - and while I can kind of see where those people are coming from, I also think that's completely the wrong approach to backing a Kickstarter. It's not supposed to be like a pre-order system where you're looking to get the 'best deal' from your purchase, and if you back a project for that reason then you're bound to be disappointed.

      Putting the beta on Early Access doesn't take anything away from the people who backed previously. If anything it should help them, by giving the devs more beta-testers and extra funds to polish the game. They're still getting all the rewards they were promised (most of which aren't available through Early Access), as well as less tangible benefits, like the insight into the development process, and of course the satisfaction of having helped create something. Each to his own, I guess, but that hardly seems to me like getting the short end of the stick.

    7. Lee Sweeney on

      Never again, inXile are liars and crooks.

    8. BlackGauntlet
      Superbacker
      on

      @Helena - "When the devs say 'released to the public' they're talking about the final, completed game, not the beta." - Uh... no, it's not. Everyone (backers and public) can get the final, completed game at the same time. InXile definitely meant the Beta version; which Premium Backers definitely got 1 week earlier (even if it's the same version publicly available on Steam Early Access).

      So, anyway, let's do a short comparison, shall we?
      Backers: $20 (Early Bird) + $20 (Beta Access) = $40 Non-refundable pledge locked down for at least 3 years
      Non-backers: $45 Fully refundable at any time.

      Basic Financial studies taught that money in hand is always more valuable than money you can use in the future. Anybody with a bank account that offers positive interest rates of 5% can get you back more than $46 after 3 years.

      Imagine if you did NOT back the game 3 years ago, you are $1 richer AND you can get Early Access to this game that you wanted back then! What's more, you can refund it if you didn't like it for ANY reason (i.e. if you expected RTwP but it's now turn-based) from Steam and totally save that $45.

      So what I said earlier still stands. It's a good thing I don't want Early Access or I'd be a lot more vocal (and angrier) than this but I truly feel that backers are given the short end of the stick.

      If you call this fair, Helena, you'd need a full course in basic Economics that even the dumbest banker in the world could teach you what you should do with your money, for free (like I said, he's dumb). There is a huge difference between us and non-backers; without us, there is NO GAME.

    9. Estimated delivery: Dec 2014 on

      Why is this for sale on Steam to non-backers?

    10. Randy Jimenez on

      @ Helena: Yup, I understand that development delays happen and release targets are missed. I've been buying games since the 80's and I've backed over 140 kickstarter projects, mostly games. I've also been involved in software development for my entire career, albeit not in games. I've been through my share of delays. It's great for inXile that they received enough funding to build a larger game that would take longer. They chose to swing for a loftier goal and not deliver on the initial timeline and were able to do so because of the pledges we provided. It's important to remember where that funding came from to build that game. The only reason they're able to sell this game via Early Access is because we funded its initial development. 20 bucks given early should be valued more than 20 bucks paid today. In investment, early investors are given a bargain or premium that is better than what later investors get. In our case, the premium assigned by inXile getting our money 3 years ago is lower than I would have hoped. I didn't mean to demanded extra rewards. My point was that inXile is undervaluing our pledges. They're in a position to provide some value in return for our early funds and faith and are choosing not to. That is what leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Sure, this happens all the time on kickstarter. Kickstarter is used as another marketing channel, another place to garner pre-orders instead of a way to partner with folks who believe in you and your project. I thought better of inXile. I'll enjoy torment when I get it in a year or 2. After backing 2 of their projects, I'm disappointed but will vote with my wallet and not fund another project from them. I'll end my rand there

    11. Helena on

      @ Lim: No, there definitely has not been a separate closed beta release. The beta version that backers got is the same one that's on Steam Early Access; they just received it a few days earlier. When the devs say 'released to the public' they're talking about the final, completed game, not the beta.

      Regarding pricing, bear in mind that people who chose the $75 tier get a whole lot of extra rewards that aren't available to Early Access backers. Those who only wanted the game + beta could back at the $20/$25 level and then add an extra $20 for beta access, meaning they pay the same amount (or less) for the same thing the Early Access people are getting. I don't see how that's a bad thing?

      @ Randy: The December 2014 release date was only ever an estimate, and that was for the original $800k version of the game, not the expanded version with stretch goals etc. Since the devs received more than 5 times the original funding goal, they're making a much bigger and more complex game, which obviously takes a lot longer. I realise it's frustrating, but unfortunately this kind of delay is very common in game development, even for games that aren't funded through Kickstarter. Large games like this frequently take months or even years longer than originally planned, simply because the devs run into problems that they couldn't have predicted (for example, one of the projects I've backed had to rework the entire game to run in a new engine, because the old version wasn't being supported any longer). So I don't really think it's reasonable to demand extra rewards because of that.

    12. Randy Jimenez on

      Late to the conversation but have to agree with some of the comments. This leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Yes I pledged for the final release and never expected to receive Early Access. But I also pledged for a final release that was expected in December 2014 which was over a year ago. So I didn't pledge expecting Early Access but I also didn't pledge expecting LATE Access. I'd argue that any release past the original intended release date is due to folks who pledged with an expectation of the original date. Sure, I could fork over another $20 and get early access. I'd save a whole $5 bucks! But my $20 has been tied up in this campaign for nearly 3 years. It should be worth more than $20 to inXile because I believed in them 3 years ago not this week when the game was released on Early Access. So no, I'm not forking over any more money to inXile. I think I've spent enough and waited long enough.

    13. BlackGauntlet
      Superbacker
      on

      @Helena - There WAS a closed Beta release to backers of the $75, $80, $125, $130, $250 & $275 tier along with those who forked out $20.

      It was closed (as agreed on the Pledge description; stating " You'll also receive Beta Test Access where you can experience Torment before it is released to the public." )

      If it's available on Steam Early Access, anybody who has an account on that platform with a working credit card can buy this game. I seriously can't say that's NOT public.

    14. BlackGauntlet
      Superbacker
      on

      Yeah! The lowest tier you have to pay here to get Beta Access is $75. Not $45 for Steam Early Access. BUT! If you were one of the CHEEP Early Bird who only paid $20, you only need to fork out another $20! That's $5 less than Steam Early Access!

      Uh... Okay... it doesn't sound like that's a good thing.

      Anyway, MsDemeaner and Helena are both not wrong.

      Early Access is not Beta.
      BUT many developers send in Beta versions of their game into Steam for Early Access sales.

      So, the lines are blurred but, make no mistake, there is still a line.

    15. Bradford Lounsberry on

      Early Access is commonly used for beta. Hilarious how a few people are trying to convince others that it isn't beta. Early Access games are never considered released until they are out of Early Access and released.

    16. Helena on

      @ MsDemeaner: The 'commercially available' version on Steam is the same one available to anyone who previously pledged for beta access, either through Kickstarter or through the website. You're acting like the Early Access buyers are getting some kind of special deal which wasn't available to Kickstarter backers. They're not. It's the exact same thing, for the same price.

      And of course it matters that this is a beta, because inXile made it clear right from the start that backers would only get beta access if they pledged extra money for it. The Early Access people are all getting to play the beta now because that's what they've paid for: access to the current (beta) version, plus access to the final game once it's released. Anyone who didn't pledge for the beta originally can add it to their pledge, right now, and they'll also get instant access to the build that's on Steam (the one you're calling a 'retail release', even though it's obviously a beta).

      You seem to think there's something magical about putting the beta on Steam Early Access that transforms it into a retail release, even though the same deal has been openly available through inXile's website for the past 3 years. If that's the case, you need to explain why, because I'm genuinely not seeing the logic there. And calling people 'idiots' with 'low IQs' doesn't make your position any stronger; it just makes it clear that it's *not* logical, otherwise you'd be able to argue your case without resorting to insults and name-calling.

    17. Michael Austin on

      Personally I am happy that they have opened up the game to the general public - this means that the beta version will have more people playing it, hopefully resulting in a more polished game. Additionally, people who may have missed the kickstarter are still able to gain access which is great. I don't get why anyone would want fewer people to have access to the game, this seems selfish to me.

      I understand that the backers got in on the ground floor but that should be out of love for the game and not because of any rewards you get out of it. That's the general idea of kickstarter, supporting an idea that you love and hopefully bringing it to life.

      The one thing that I think is a little annoying is that some of the high cost tiers did not come with beta access, meaning that some backers are missing out on it while having paid more. You have to keep in mind that those tiers also included a lot of extra content that is not available with the retail release, much like a "collector's edition". What it comes down to though is that if being in the beta was important to you then you should have backed a tier that included it.

    18. MsDemeaner on

      @Helena. HOW MANY TIMES TO I HAVE TO SAY THAT THE BETA IS IRRELEVANT!!!!!?!??!!?

      This has nothing with that. Stop. You clearly have no understanding on the issue at all.

      The ONLY issue is that a commercially available version has been released to everyone who buys it, except those that purchased it prior to being listed on Steam.

      You have 2 groups that have purchased the game. One group purchased 3 years ago and most can't play the game.

      The state of the game is irrelevant. If people don't want to play it that's fine, but it should be their choice.

      You are talking about things that have ZERO bearing on the matter at hand. So stop referencing it.

      Development beta is irrelevant once you make the title available at retail. Even if that retail version is incomplete.

      You're points have NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH THE CURRENT SITUATION.

    19. Helena on

      @ MsDemeaner: I do understand, but you're mistaken in thinking there's already been a closed beta. If you check back through the updates page, you won't find any references to a previous beta release, only the alpha. The version on Steam *is* the beta, the one that was promised in the campaign, and the fact that it's an open rather than closed beta doesn't change that. Let me quote from the release notes I mentioned earlier:

      "The Torment: Tides of Numenera Beta Test includes the introduction to the game, and much of the city of Sagus Cliffs, making for approximately 10 hours of gameplay. [...]

      - The user interface is at a first-pass state. It is functional, but sytlistically and artistically unfinished. This will see significant improvement in the coming months.
      - Merchants and trading are not yet in the game. To comepensate, we've added some more items and equipment to containers throughout the environments.
      - Combat and gameplay balance is at a first-pass state.
      - Not all character Foci are implemented yet."

      Does that sound like a retail release to you - a build with half the locations and a significant amount of content missing? In the other section you say that making the game 'commercially available' is what matters, but it's been 'open to anyone' through inXile's website ever since the end of the Kickstarter - why does putting it on Steam suddenly make all the difference? And even if it did, how does that make it any less of a beta? You yourself admit that the game is still in a beta state.

      I realise that some devs release nearly-complete versions of their game through Early Access, and post incremental updates until the full release. That's not what's happening here. This is an actual beta version - an incomplete section of the game that inXile have released for testing and feedback purposes, as they did with Wasteland 2. The final release will come later, and that's when we non-beta backers will get our keys.

    20. MsDemeaner on

      @Helena just pasting from the other comment section.
      The fundamental issue here is that EVERY person that picks up the game on Steam gets instant access to the current build. This is because the game has been released (in an unfinished state). Every person that purchased the game should be treated the same. This is no longer a closed Alpha or Beta, it is a retail release open to anyone. To actively say that one group cant have access based purely on when they paid is what the issue is.
      All they need to do is send out the Steam keys we have already paid for. The release on Steam changes EVERYTHING. I am not talking about the closed Beta, or Alpha, or anything other than those who buy now get their Steam key instantly, while the rest of consumers who have also paid are not deemed worthy of getting the key that they paid for.

      Understand?

    21. Helena on

      @ MsDemeaner: I've paid over $100 too, and I don't have beta access either. Does this bother me? No, because I knew exactly what I had (and hadn't) paid for, I've been following the updates, and I knew the Early Access release was coming.

      Like I said, "shut up" isn't an argument. You don't have any actual replies to the points I made? Fine, whatever.

    22. MsDemeaner on

      @Helena. STFU.
      I've paid over $100 there is a principle here and your ignorant apologist crap is not helping. Run along no one wants to hear your ignorant prattle.

    23. Helena on

      @ MsDemeaner: "You need to be quiet" is not an argument; nor is "shut up you're not helping". To address your actual points:

      - No one ever said this would be a closed beta. InXile haven't 'changed the rules' by going to Early Access; they're simply doing what many other Kickstarter projects have done, including their *own previous game*, Wasteland 2. The fact that the beta is open to the public through Early Access doesn't make it any less of a beta; it's still a buggy, incomplete build released for testing purposes, not a retail release of the full game. It doesn't even include half the locations from the full game, just the intro sequence plus Sagus Cliffs. If you don't believe me, try reading the release notes or watching the IGN gameplay video (both linked in the update above) to see exactly what's included in this build and what isn't.

      - The people buying through Steam have instant access to the beta *because they are paying more*. During the Kickstarter campaign, the minimum pledge to get the game itself - without beta - was $25 (or $20 for the limited early-bird tier). You could then add on $20 for beta access, making a total of $45 - exactly what the people on Steam are paying. In addition, the Kickstarter backers got access to the beta several days early. How is this in any way unfair or disrespectful? You are getting exactly what you pledged for - no more, no less.

      If you didn't want beta access originally, you have no reason to complain about it now. If you've changed your mind and decided you do want it, go ahead and pay the extra $20. If you're determined to ignore everything inXile have said and insist that this is a full retail release when it blatantly isn't - well, there's clearly not much point in our trying to have a rational discussion about it.

    24. Christina on

      Yeah, this is ridiculous. It's for sale at a retail outlet, that's a release folks. Whether you're done tinkering with it or not, that's far outside the scope of a beta. I don't care what mental gymnastics you've gone through to justify this to yourselves but because it's for sale to the public now I either want my key or I want a refund with interest for loaning you the money for 3 years.

    25. MsDemeaner on

      @Eric Schwarz Not even remotely acceptable. You've failed to address the main issue. Its not able exclusivity. Its about access given for standard purchased. Or that EVERY person that buys the game on Steam has instant access to it, but the people that also purchased the game, but prior to the Steam Early Access release don't get access. Stop trying to hide behind the tiers as that went out the window when you changed the rules by going early access. The ONLY reason you have a product to put on Early Access is all of us, and we don't even get the consideration to sample that despite being the reason for its existence.

      You are actively disrespecting every single backer.

      You have said quite clearly that we are a means to an ends.

      You have shown that all you care about is getting money in, and show no consideration to your eager and loyal fans that gave you money in good faith almost 3 years ago.

      Show some actual respect for your customer and extend the Early Access to EVERY PERSON THAT PURCHASED THE GAME!

    26. MsDemeaner on

      @Helena you need to be quiet. You don't know what you're talking about, and clearly have zero understanding between a closed beta and retail Early Access.

      So shut up you're not helping and only making things worse.

    27. Zettai
      Superbacker
      on

      @Helena, I think that there's been a communication problem. I don't think backers would have any problem at all if inXile had emailed us explaining that they were looking for more beta testers or money and that in order to get that, they were planning on selling an Early Access on Steam.

      I feel like a second class player actually, instead of feeling treated with privileges for being a backer since day 1. It is not about money or beta access, it's about communication and frustration.

      Frustration for the delays and for thinking about other people enjoying the game before us, and the lack of communication with all this Early Access process. I know the game is buggy, unfinished and unpolished but well... It's about getting access before anybody else.

      Now, at least, inXile has given an explanation, even if it comes late and doesn't calm things down. We'll see what comes out of this, hopefully we will all learn something.

      Cheers

    28. Helena on

      @ Michael: The game hasn't been released. The beta version doesn't include all the locations in the final game, and a lot of content is missing, unfinished or just plain buggy. Everyone buying through Early Access is essentially paying for the privilege of being an unpaid beta tester. If you want to do that, go ahead and add $20 to your pledge; otherwise stop complaining about not getting something you haven't paid for.

      @ InXile: Looks like GOG.com just created their own version of Early Access: http://www.gog.com/news/introducing_games_in_development . Any chance of seeing the Torment beta come to GOG at some point?

    29. Michael DeOssie on

      Glad that after waiting almost three years, someone else just gets to roll in with $45 and play the game before me. I've seen games go years in early access. How long till the cutoff when you finally admit it's released?

    30. Sir Chaox on

      Thanks, Eric!

      So, I had the wrong idea before on WL2's EA release; they actually did a similar thing back then as well, by delivering the beta only a day before entering EA. Now knowing that this EA release is being treated more or less the same as WL2, it seems this is not out of the ordinary as I originally thought. Maybe some backers here have had different experiences from other projects and carried over those expectations... Hopefully, they will change their minds. I myself am content and look forward to hearing more about the game. I still understand why some are upset (giving original backers first crack at the game before the public is an idea that makes sense to me as well), but inXile has done right by their backers in the past, and I'm sure they will again before the release.

    31. inXile entertainment 3-time creator on

      Hey everyone,

      First up, I do want to thank you for your input and feedback. We've been monitoring this discussion closely.

      I'd like to reiterate up front that all backers get the exact same rewards they pledged for (and in some cases [i]more[/i] than they pledged for). The minimum pledge level to get beta access and the final game was $20 + $20, or $40 total, which is cheaper than we are charging for Early Access on Steam - and backers at higher levels also got the chance for premium collector's edition boxes, statues, and other digital and physical goodies that Steam users won't receive.

      It is also worth mentioning (since there has been some confusion), that the Steam Early Access release is not the final game release. Anyone who pledged to get the final version of the game will still get it exactly as they pledged for once it's out.

      Our rewards structure for Torment was a bit more complicated than Wasteland 2, in that beta access was not granted at one set pledge amount, but varied depending on things like whether the reward was digital or physical, included bonus games or not, etc. That's one major reason why the beta access add-on was rolled out - to allow people who wanted both the cool extras and goodies, but whose reward packages didn't include it, to still get the beta if they wanted.

      We do understand concerns regarding perceptions of exclusivity, but we never made any claims that backers would have access to the beta in perpetuity or for any specific length of time (but we did give the beta content to our backers first as promised, and cheapest at the minimum level as well).

      We let our backers change their reward contents at any time on the Torment web site if they want, provided they haven't collected any of those rewards (and even then, if they have, we can usually work out some sort of solution on a case-by-case basis for each backer). All of our backers are welcome tweak and switch up their rewards and get beta access right now, if they so choose, and will be able to for at least the immediate future.

      The fact is that we depend upon our backers as well as innovative business models like crowdfunding to help make our games better for everyone. Steam Early Access is another part of that pie which helps us continue making games. We build our titles for niche audiences, not the mass market, and we do not have infinite budgets to do so. We were able to make Wasteland 2 bigger and better as a result of Early Access letting us extend development, and we hope to do the same for Torment. Crowdfunding and Early Access are all enablers for us to continue making games in the first place, and to over-deliver on those we are able to make.

      Thanks for your understanding!

      Best,
      Eric Schwarz
      Line Producer

    32. Sir Chaox on

      I believe they are doing EA like this because they may be running out of funds. Sorry to say if this is the case, but development has gone on longer for this project than others. They may be hoping for avenues of funds from both current backers by paying $20 for the beta and new customers paying for EA on Steam. As others pointed out, this is an early beta, and still very clunky, but as original backers, we ought to be included despite our pledge and add-ons once the game is open for sale. Technically, the full game is for sale, but customers are only getting access to the EA version right now; as a backer, we should be considered in the same category as these new customers and given the same access to the EA version. If beta purchasers feel cheated, maybe a bonus credit can be provided. Obviously, having a week of closed beta and then opening it up could not have been part of their original strategy.

    33. krist2 - Weresheepherder of Original Sin on

      I think Larian Studios did it better with Divinity: Original Sin when they decided to release it on early access. They gave early access keys to all backers, regardless of pledge level.
      There was of course some misgivings from some of the backers, but not to bad.
      And Larian got a lot of extra data and input to make the game better for all.

    34. Greek Winter Media on

      Bad form giving random Steam users access before your loyal backers. As others have mentioned, it feels like a slap in the face in exchange for our loyalty and believing in/funding your product. Disappointed.

    35. Mikel Muxika on

      It's awesome how i got a notification on the PoE project updates about THIS game's early access, but they didn't post it in its own update section!!!

      It is clear to me that InXile have decided that it is more important to get more money than doing right by the people who backed their proposal/project/dream, way to go, i'm sure the backers here cannot wait to fling money for your next pitch...

      Sadly dissapointed...
      I hope the game is at least good ...

    36. Wally on

      @Duskwind - Fair enough. I remember I opted out of beta so that I could wait for the full game. It just makes me jealous is all. I'm assuming I can still add $20 to my pledge if I want that early access...

    37. Alex on

      So apparently we can pay 2000 "points" for "beta" access via the website, or can pay 2000 points for AN ADDITIONAL COPY?

      What!?

    38. Kordanor on

      @Duskwind I can see the point. But still, doesn't feel right.

      My main concern however was how to actually get the key. Or is the whole option only available once keys are unlocked?

    39. Duskwind on

      @Kordanor - you paid for the collector's edition box with cloth map, manual, art book, and soundtrack CD, plus a bunch of digital rewards. Steam customers obviously don't get any of that.

    40. Zack on

      *how much better Pillars...

    41. Zack on

      Between this, Early Access and not to mention how Wasteland 2 turned out and how much Pillars of Eternity was, I really want my money back. For sure will never back or buy a project from you guys again. What a miserable experience this has been.

    42. Kordanor on

      I backed with 95$. Now apparently that didn't include beta access which is kinda disappointing if even new players from steam get beta. But I am also wondering about the "Manage Keys" button mentioned in the update. Does this button only appear if you actually have keys? Because I can't find it.

    43. Missing avatar

      Valerie North on

      This is very poor on the part of the devs. We backed the game on kickstarter when it was nothing more than a dream and a plan. I was happy to wait to see something. Apparently, people that didn't care to back the dream have the opportunity to play long before we do. That is all kinds of wrong. When Elite Dangerous ran their kickstarter, all kickstarters got steam keys so they could enjoy the early fruit of the dream.

    44. Duskwind on

      @Wally - the fruit isn't ripe yet! It'll taste much better if you wait. And the Early Access beta testers are paying nearly twice as much for the game as you did.

    45. Gary Wattson on

      I see the game is for sale on Steam but I can't find a way to get a copy despite paying for it. Please tell me how to get my Key.

    46. Wally on

      I pledged $25 in March of 2013 and you are well past your delivery date. Not once did I complain about that... It's nice to see others eat the fruit that I've been waiting for.

    47. Jala Prendes (Neon Skies Studio LLC) on

      I was dismayed to see Torment up for Early Access, but the backers don't get codes? :/

    48. SlyDave on

      Add me to the list of backers both confused and angered by your latest decision in regards to EA.

    49. Toxic Chibi on

      Ridiculous. Please let me know when it's convenient for you to let me try the game I helped fund.

    50. Missing avatar

      AdonisChrist on

      I completely agree with the others - backers who have supported this game from the get-go should all be given early access codes. Get your cash infusion, sure, but don't slap your backers in the face by doing so.

      It's abominable to even have to say this.