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From the creators of Osmos comes Karmaka, a competitive card game that plays out over multiple lives.
From the creators of Osmos comes Karmaka, a competitive card game that plays out over multiple lives.
7,198 backers pledged $220,852 to help bring this project to life.

Ready for Proofs!

Posted by Eddy Boxerman (Creator)
93 likes

Hey everyone! It's been a while so we thought we'd let you know how things are moving along. The short version is: we've submitted all our digital art files to our manufacturer (Panda) and are awaiting final approval. There's been a fair bit of back and forth so far, with micro-tweaks to box sizing, blacks + overprinting, the plastic insert, etc. Pictures and details below...

The Box

We've nailed down Karmaka's box size (167 x 218 x 42mm, roughly 6.6" x 8.6" x 1.7") and worked with Marco and Scott to finalize the design. We're really happy with it! Here's a render of how it'll look.

We also have a fun "eternally rolling beetle" motif going around all four sides of the box. Oh, the endless toils of our humble and faithful friend...

The Insert

This has turned out to be the trickiest manufactured component in the game, in large part because it was difficult to get clear requirements from Panda as to how to submit a design, and what constraints we had to work with. The good news is we're almost there, and the rest of production (meeples and all cardboard/printed parts) can chug along even as we're finalizing the design and getting prototypes of the insert made. Here's our work-in-progress design, modelled by our talented friend Warren Marshall.

In general we really love this design and think Warren did a beautiful job. There's only one problem: Panda informed us that the meeple trough is too deep given its narrow width, and could cause production issues/flaws. As such we're going to rework things so as to lie the meeples down. It'll be a bit of a squeeze, but we'll make it work.

And yes, those mocked-up cards in the card wells are sleeved. ;-)

Meeples

Panda created and sent us prototypes of our custom meeples. Here are a few photos:

They look great! We're going to make a slight color tweak to the black and blue ones so they're easier to tell apart in low lighting. (How much blacker can that black meeple get? You may be thinking "None. None more black." But in pantone-land there are many versions of black!) Anyway, these babies are pretty much good-to-go.

Rules

We've made some final micro-tweaks to the rules, mostly cosmetic. If you're willing to look 'em over, we'd really appreciate the feedback! Modulo any feedback / typos, this is the version that will go to print!

All the cards and the Karmic Ring tokens are finalized and submitted as well of course. Hopefully the proofing process will go quickly and smoothly and we'll be able to update you with more news soon!

PS: we have not yet sent out surveys to collect shipping addresses, so no need to inform us if you've moved. We'll gather that info as we get closer to fulfillment.

Wouter Celis, Tom, and 91 more people like this update.

Comments

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    1. Marcus Zwolsky on

      First of all, GREAT JOB! This looks fantastic!
      Not sure if someone spotted it already, but there's an error in the linked version of the rules.
      On page 10, in the Multiplayer section it says "[...] beginning with the
      player to your YOUR left and going [...]". I'm pretty sure only one "your" is necessary here ;)

    2. Tanner Louderback on

      Maybe change the color of the black meeple to white, if not green, to keep the meeples light and colorful like the game.

    3. Brad103 on

      Red-Green Colorblind here. And the symbols on the cards to help a lot. Under certain lighting I have mistaken these cards at times. Though, I think the meeples are a bold enough color that a green one would be fine for most people. If they go with a more pastel look though better stick with that yellow guy. I'm fine with how the meeples look now, I think pastel colors would improve the feel of the game, but the colors presented above work fine for me as is.

    4. Morten Notodden on

      And hasty as I am, I replied before reading the replies from Eddy. Sorry about that.

      I completely understand your reasoning behind exluding green. Thumbs up for considering color blindness in component design! I spoke from a completely selfish standpoint. Keep it black :)

    5. Morten Notodden on

      Personally, I would rather exclude the black meeple instead of the yellow one. Karmaka is a colorful game. Keep the meeples colored. And I also like the bright colors since the karmic ladder is VERY colorful. No pastels going on there.

      Also, I love yellow! :D

    6. Eddy Boxerman Creator on

      @Tim: The rings will be 32mm.

      @Chris: Yes, the insert will fit sleeved cards.

    7. Eddy Boxerman Creator on

      Thanks for all the rules feedback as well! (David, Francois, Tim, atarihomestar, Laurie, and John.) Much appreciated.

      We'll discuss that deed-scoring section and see if we can make it even clearer. That said, all our play-testers have understood it as it is, even if there's a moment / sentence or two where there's a question in their mind. We need to be careful about last-minute changes which could risk that.

      Numbers: generally I agree it's proper to write 'two' rather than '2', but using the digit keeps the rules short, and is easier to spot when hunting/scanning for a specific item. (Which is a common type of rules lookup.)

    8. Eddy Boxerman Creator on

      Sounds like meeple colors is the hottest topic. We don't want to delay production, but we'll have an internal conversation and see if we can/should tweak them at all.

      For the record, I agree it's sad not to have a green meeple (one of Karmaka's card colors, plus I love green!) but we left it out for color-blindness reasons. This isn't an issue on the cards because we also have different symbols to represent the colors, but since the meeples are all the same shape we feel it's important to take this into account. And since green-red and green-blue are the two most common forms of color blindness, avoiding green helps a lot. I've also noticed green-blue confusion to be a common problem in many games when played in low/ok light, even for non-color-blind people. A soft yellow seemed to be a nice compromise.

      Regarding the hues, we based them on the Karmic Ladder, which has more saturated colors than the box art. You can get an idea how they fit by looking at the box bottom image above. We figured this makes sense since they'll be living on the Ladder during the game. That said, we've lightened the blue to make it more of a sky color that'd fit the box art. Again, we'll discuss and see if we can/should make any other modifications.

    9. Eddy Boxerman Creator on

      Thanks for the feedback, everyone! I'll hit the various topics in several replies...

    10. John Michael Thomas
      Superbacker
      on

      Kudos on the rules - I went through them and they're very well written and concise. For the most part I agree with some of the previous comments; here's my 2 cents worth:

      I agree with the ambiguity of the word "strongest", at least when it first appears (when I first read it, I didn't understand what it meant - though I understood after reading further). I suggest being more clear about it when you first use it, e.g. "your strongest color (the color which gives you the highest total points)".

      Agree with referencing the Karmic Ring tokens (vs. just karmic rings). Using digits or spelled out numbers could go either way - technical documentation usually spells numbers out (and I'm comfortable with this because I'm a technical writer), but I still think digits are usually clearer for non-technical people. Agree that a picture or diagram of a full in-play game would be helpful.

      Regarding the meeple colors - no big deal either way. Changing colors might make more people happy, though, since those that don't care about the current colors probably won't care about it if you change them either (but from the comments the reverse doesn't appear to be true).

    11. atarihomestar on

      Laurie, I don't see why, in any version, you need the sentence "Players may claim points for only one color of Deed per life." If you follow the steps directly after that sentence, you'd end up claiming points for only one color.

      Also, I can't believe the number of people I talk to who get a game and then don't play it because they couldn't understand the rule book. I don't know if most people would equate "strongest" with the color that you have the most cards of. I mean, what if I had yellow cards of 4 and 2, and red cards of 1, 2, and 1. I think some people might think that yellow is the "strongest", since you have 6 total points on them and only 4 on the red cards.

    12. Laurie on

      I think the wording is fine as is - it's succinct. They already refer to the Deed cards in the preceding sentence. No need to mention it again. If anything, perhaps change "best" to "strongest," but that's it. My two cents.

    13. atarihomestar on

      Looks great. I'm excited to get the game.

      I read through the rules and I understood everything without much effort at all, except for the part on page 8 about the scoring.

      It says: "To tally your score when dying, simply add up the points in your best color."

      Tally them up from where? What is your “best” color? The example even refers to it as your “strongest” color. I think this is more clear:

      To tally your score when dying, simply add up the points on the cards in your deed pile that you have the most color in. Then, add the points on any Mosaic (wild) cards that are in your deed pile. Finally, add a point for each Karmic Ring that you wish to trade in. Then, if that total is enough to advance…

    14. Brendan Riley on

      Great update! (Except that I wish you hadn't linked to the Spinal Tap clip so I could feel smug that I recognized the quote. :D )

    15. Missing avatar

      Chris Kletz on

      Will the box be big enough to allow for cards to be sleeved?

    16. Laurie on

      The box art and insert look awesome! Agree with others that the meeple colors look way out of place in this game. Oh well, whatever you decide, I'm sure we'll get over it...or replace them with after-market meeples.

    17. Philip Alexander Dale on

      I too take issue with the colours; specifically I agree with those who object to the inclusion of yellow instead of green.

      Blue and Red are both colours for Karmaka cards, it seems weird in the extreme that there isn't a matching green piece too given that Green is also an important colour in Karmaka.

    18. Brian on

      I love the color of the meeples and wouldn't change a thing.

    19. JurassicMatt
      Superbacker
      on

      +1 for different coloured meeples. Your current colours just clash with the game! Since you're still tweaking the colours it seems like it should be fairly easy to draw softer colours that are actually used on the cards.

    20. Missing avatar

      Lenore
      Superbacker
      on

      I agree that the meeples are miscoloured. If they remain in these bright in-Karmanic colours, I'll be painting them right away.

    21. Missing avatar

      Tim Schnars on

      Thanks for the update. I have two suggestions:

      -The meeple colors don't seem to gel with the rest of the color scheme. They should reflect the card "personalities" by matching up with the tones on those cards, eg. red, green, blue, mosaic.

      -On page eight of the rule book, could you make "you don’t move up the
      ladder and instead receive a Karmic Ring" in bold? For me, that is the one rule that felt under stressed when I originally read the rules.

    22. Chris Laudermilk on

      Nasty, cruel Baginses... ;p I usually "get" to play yellow with the family, so...me!

      I do agree, the primary-colored meeples are a little out of place with the tones of the rest of the game. Other than that very minor quibble, it looks great.

      Extra thumb for the Spinal Tap reference. :)

    23. Baginses
      Superbacker
      on

      I have to agree I don't like the meeple colors... they are too primary (bold) as previously noted. Also, we will have to fight over who has to play as yellow (cuz who wants to play as ugly yellow?). Where's my green :(

    24. Ryan Benedict Silva
      Superbacker
      on

      @Dave that was what I was going to say! Ditto on both the green and sky blue colors.

    25. Dave on

      I hope the blue tweek would be more towards the colour of the sky on the box. I do love the green in the cards too maybe change yellow for that?

    26. Denver Garrison
      Superbacker
      on

      I agree with "primary colored" meeples. I think that they would be so much better in colors that are not so... basic. For such a cool game I think it would be much better with other colors. Overall looking great =]

    27. Salvador Bernadó Sala
      Superbacker
      on

      I like the look of the box.
      And it seems this is an insert I won't throw away.
      Looking forward to play the game soon.

    28. Stephanie on

      Thanks for the update. Everything looks amazing so far. I'm especially loving the insert!

    29. Tabitha Karcher on

      LOVE the box art!!

    30. HedgeWizzard
      Superbacker
      on

      This looks really great.

    31. Francois LC on

      Thanks for the update.

      Great rule book... simple and concise.

      Just a few comments on it:

      1- On page 5, maybe you could show meeples on the karmic ladder to really display a full in-game play area view.

      2- On page 11, your copyright should be 2016 as the release is in 2016, not 2015.

      Again thank you for the update.

    32. kathryn dowell
      Superbacker
      on

      Everything looks great, particularly the insert!

    33. Missing avatar

      David Govaker on

      You invited "copyedit" comments... Here's mine:
      You frequently use digits for numbers in the instructions (e.g., "Deal 4 cards...". " Then deal 2 more cards..."
      Some consider that numbers less than ten should be spelled out rather than using digits. (And I realize you may be doing this on purpose.)
      Also, I take it that the "Karmic Rings" are not actually rings, but are cardboard discs. You may want to call them "Karmic Ring discs" or "chits".
      Overall GREAT JOB! I'm enjoying playing a solitaire version I developed myself. Happy to share the rules for this if you're interested....
      BEST -- dg
      (CyberDocFP@hotmail.com)

    34. Joshua Heard on

      Great progress. I will admit, I'm a little surprised you're not going with lighter, pastel type colors for the meeples. Given the airy, zen-ish feel of the box and the art in general, the meeples feel sooo...primary-colored? Still look great though, love everything.

    35. Tim Braun
      Superbacker
      on

      What will be the diameter of the Karmic Ring tokens? I'm looking to replace them with actual metal rings and would like to match the size