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I have not been following this, but I found my box in a corner, covered in dust so I decided to check up on it... LOL what a poop show.
I couldn't, in good conscience, back a Kickstarter that had anyone from the ST involved. ST is still the ONLY KS campaign that I have been burned on. My friend and I went in on the tier (for ST) that had basically every card and basically 2 of everything...didn't even have enough of most cards to create starter decks that were listed in the recommendations :|
While I do sympathize with the fact that things got altered for team it really is a case of "it is what it is". The lack of transparency, updates, and honesty is what really matters and what most of us will remember at the end of the day.
I love the Armored Core franchise and was willing to back that project despite the involvement of "key members of the Serpent's Tongue" team, but now that I know who that key member is and the fact that they had to change the name of the project because they didn't have the AC license (they will probably have to change a lot of the art and mech designs as well) I am out of that project. It is beyond unprofessional to participate in another Kickstarter project when you haven't been able to completely fulfill a previous one!!!
they now have a new kickstarter...armored core....https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/223137030/armored-coretm-rts-a-real-time-strategy-board-game
I'm still bummed that my friend and I couldn't even make 2 full decks to play against each other (at least based on the suggested ones) from the massive KS rewards we received :|
Looks like there was an update posted on becomemagi by him after he was arrested so it looks like he's still plugging away.
This is an interesting turn of events.
That's all crazy. My friend and I went in together on one of the packs that came with an entire box of spell cards and compendiums (not to mention paid extra for the backer compendiums) and we didn't even have enough cards in the box to make the suggested decks to use, which was ridiculous. Game was plagued almost from the start. If I'm not mistaken some backers didn't get anything.
Oh well, live and learn. After backing everything I have I can honestly say Serpent's Tongue will always be remembered by me as the one Kickstarter that definitely didn't pan out.
He should have used a spell to settle this dispute.
I backed another partially completed project called Purge: Sins of Science and the creators of that game ended up in being arrested for arson/vandalism and so that game was never completed. Oh well.
Wow, Wendell. That's some sleuthing.
And that photo is definitely him. Looks like Christopher has lost his marbles and we're out the rest of what's owed us. No Founders Codex, no Spell Compendium, no Kickstarter backer rewards.
At least he partially delivered, which is more than I can say for another guy who said he was making a card game and then ran off to Australia with the funds and we never heard from him again.
I do hope everyone who backed got SOMETHING, at least.
What's sad is I can't even play this damned thing. I have such a bad taste in my mouth from all this that the two starter sets and all the expansion packs (like 6 boxes worth) are just sitting in the cardboard shipping box collecting dust. :(
I wound up doing some internet stalking, and found Chris's facebook page (not exactly hard detective work). His profile now says "Worked at UnBound Games LLC". Past tense.
Sounds like everything's all done, unofficially.
Yeah I'd say that's it for this one...... Unreal
Can probably hang this one up as finished.
"Our esteemed leader, Magi Gabrielson, is missing, so this update does not include any information about shipping product, timelines, etc."
According to the becomemagi.com serpent's tongue website, the creator of the game has gone "missing". Guess that means this game is done for. More money down the toilet...
I lament all of the cool Kickstarter projects that actually delivered on their promises that I could have backed with all of the money I pledged (and lost since it hasn't been fulfilled) for this one. Where are my founder codexes and other stuff or refund?!?!?
Where are the rest of the goods?
I supported this at Master Collector level, and well have gotten nothing ever and then I finally got this last message (#37).so I am aware that product is available but that UnBound games is shy shipping costs. I have offered since then to cover my own shipping costs for product owed me and have tried contacting Chris Gabrielson and UnBound Games through Kickstarter and the site and have not received a single response- We are now approaching one month since message 37. I think its only fair I get some kind of answer.
David, as much as I'm frustrated by not getting everything I expected with my pledge here, that situation is nothing like Serpent's Tongue. Serpent's Tongue was created. It was printed. A lot of materials were shipped out. The majority of people got at least most of what they pledged for. Looks like Doom was a misappropriation of funds and was never even created. NOBODY got ANYTHING.
As frustrated as I am, give the people behind Serpent's Tongue some credit. They've gotten in over their heads and the updates aren't coming fast enough for some of us, but they DID produce, and as far as I know, they did NOT misappropriate funds. Sounds like they got screwed by the shipping company's estimates and rather than find another way to ship, they just ate the shipping costs. That's where all the money went.
I saw it at my local comic store in Plano, Texas (Madness Comics & Games), but I believe they probably acquired it through Kickstarter.
Sounds like all the money is long gone
Has anyone even seen this in retail?
Hard to generate any new income if it's not either in retail or online
This worries me as well. I contacted a friend of mine who had something similar happen to him with another Kickstarter, "The Doom That Came to Atlantic City". Eventually the FTC got involved and filed a lawsuit.
This is simply a copy and paste from the ks website. The link: http://becomemagi.com/question/how-do-i-get-the-refund-i-was-promised-back-in-the-beta-stage/
I don't know if it will still exist after this or not. The remainder of the stuff doesn't sound like it's on a boat yet, never mind being shipped. As a legacy speaker, this worries me greatly.
asked February 18, 2015
Christopher Gabrielson responded to my refund request back in the beta stage by offering me the opportunity to first try ST after it came out. I was promised a refund at that point if I so desired. I’ve been trying to get in touch with someone to collect this refund but I haven’t had any meaningful response. Please help me.
⋅ Staff ⋅ February 18, 2015
Greetings Magi Frink! Long time no see. Or read I guess.
Sorry UnBound Games is totally incapable of issue-ing any refunds right now. Our production schedule went a bit past deadline, as you are well aware, which of course extended budgets out insanely. Im glad we kept afloat through the unexpected extra 2 years. But we have quite a shipping bill to still pay off with 3 different providers ($75k in shipping alone, we did not expect THAT when we were planning the KS campaign!) as well as more freight to pay for, reward packets to distribute, Out of Eden to print up, Founders Codexs (paid for) but still to ship etc… i.e. I estimate that we are actually somewhere around… -$35k in invoices, and remaining deliverables. Fortunately our hard launch this month has gone well and we havent even started advertising yet! But every $100 totally counts and every dollar in goes towards paying off the next milestone. If we are very successful over the next quarter we will pay off everything. And then can consider these KS refunds.
We should be getting an update pretty soon, last one IIRC on the website was in march. also Grand Master C promised to give us a "State of the Union" so I'm expecting this update to include a lot of information.
Any news about this project? Still waiting on founder codices and compendiums or a refund for undelivered items.
Sorry, I keep incorrectly saying "compendium" when I actually should be calling it the "Founder's Codex". Paid for two of them but have yet to receive them or a response to any of my requests on a status update.
Any updates on the backer's compendium? Paid for two and I haven't received even one of them yet. No responses to any messages I've sent either. I'm OK with no receiving them now if I get a refund ><
I apologize, it's been a while since my last update. We have been really busy finalizing cards, website updates, etc....Here is a link to the FULL info posted on the website.
I know it sounds like we have been talking about these Avak’Shar printing plates for months now – (and we have). But we finally have positive movement.
I normally would not bore you with the details but for those who want them; the timeline of the Avak’Shar delays is as follows:
February: The randomization issues of inscription packs are fully documented and realized. - Negotiations with Lijia are begun as to how to fix them, correct this problem.
March – Negotiations continue, UB realizes there will be little to no compensation from the factory, but starts pushing for a discount on the Avak’Shar card printing.
April Negotiations continue
May - Negotiations finalized- UB receives a discount on Avak’Shar card printing allowing more to be printed and thus given out more freely to thus alleviate the worst of the issues suffering from poor randomizations.
June UB decides to build in Backer Stories into the next set of artifacts, as they required a new plate for those cards anyway.
July The Finnish Game Breaking team found some Errata to change, these are tested and implemented.
August - Final Files sent to Lijia
September – no response from Lijia
October Lijia begins work on creating the printing plates , at which time it turns out they had broken some of the old printing plates, so UB designs new ones and sends out new files.
Nov Lijia sends proof of printing plates with errors in the backside fonts as shown below. – UB sends out NEW files.
Dec Lijia sends correct proof – UB approves the proof- Printing plate construction is begun. Avak’shar CODE redemption system goes live- Magi are able to convert their Black Avak’Shar Code Cards into secure online Avak’Shar ranks.
January Lijia finishes printing the 225,000 cards and ships them. UB decides if they can afford to air freight them to quicken the time – UB also ships over the Reward Packets with the CARDS. - Pre-reservations for Avak’Shar cards goes live – Magi are able to spend their avak’shar points on cards. Claiming the ones they want ahead of time since there is a limited supply.
February Avak’Shar cards are received in the US, UK and Australia – card distribution and reward packet distribution proceeds.
Putting in another request for status on Out Of Eden. I second that this was one of the major reasons I backed this.
Any address changes can just be made at the account page on becomemagi.com, correct? Just checking, because if it ends up at my last address I can consider it gone.
china has now completed the printing plate for the Avak'Shar Card collection. They are now on holiday until the 8th of October. They predict 2 weeks for printing and then we will ship to the USA and UK WITH the REWARD PACKETS. We hope to have the Avak'Shar redemption system online in 2-3 weeks, with the ability to redeem your points, AND spend them in a new Avak'Shar shopping cart.
For those backers who are not keeping tabs on the becomemagi website, we posted this on Sept. 18. Christopher has received a new sample of the long awaited Founder's Codex. Pictures included!
For accuracy's sake:
The post @Dave added is from 8/10 so the time frames noted in it should be taken from that day for calculation.
The latest in the forums is the following from Christopher from 8:34 this morning in response to an update on the extras:
"Yes its unacceptable we would like for it to be faster. Sorry. I assure you we are not CHOOSING to delay the rewards. They are waiting for the Avak;Shar cards to finish being printed which are being done at a ridiculously slow rate by the factory, as they are now officially 2 weeks past due."
A post from Christoper in the support forums.............
We’ve been waiting to ship reward packets over with the following:
Expanded Walkthrough / Magi Handbook
and MAYBE the compendiums if the samples turned out okay…
But these process are as usual taking longer than normal. So we are not going to wait for any of these except the Avak’Shar cards.
Greg Lahzarel Thane is doing what we hope to be the final final export tonight between 5 adn 7pm. We have been working on these Avak’Shar cards solid for two months now, and the last 2 weeks at insane levels. Why so much work for just a few cards?
Well over 40 stories were written that relate to the different factions of Serpent’s tongue and teach more about its world. These stories also incorporated many KickStarter backers as was originally promised.
In order to accomplish this the Factions, motivations, history etc.. were all flushed out to a higher degree than ever before, in preparation for an online faction guide. This is important to understand how the world of Serpent’s Tongue works and to find the faction best suited to YOU.
In addition to this we have been balancing tweaking and testing the new Avak’Shar exclusive Specializations and Artifacts.
There are TWO totally new Specializations and 9 New Versions of older Specializations.
Chasian Far Caster
4 Older Specializations were upgraded into MASTER classes, which are more expensive to unlock but much more powerful.
Master World Shaper
Master Tempus Torn
Master of the Riley Technique
5 Specializations were converted into Adept Classes, these are re-balanced versions of older specs.. Rather than making errata of current specs out there, we are leaving the older versions in circulation and performing the slight tweaks we desired in the Adept classes:
Adept of Pentad
Disciple of Cain Adept
The older versions of the new Master and Adept classes will only be available through Inscription Packs, so if you have them, congratulations; they will not be printed again, but will remain valid playable specs.
All of the Codex Building and Strategy guides were updated and improved for all specializations available through Avak’Shar as well.
Artifacts also underwent a lot of editing for clarification and in some cases game balance.
I hope to ship the printing plates off tomorrow morning. Then I will have a better estimate from Lijia on how long the printing will take (previous estimate was 2 weeks). Once its complete Reward Packets AND Avak’Shar cards will be shipped over. WE will be scheduling the pickup the moment we have a solid time estimate from Lijia so there will be as few delays as possible.
I've kinda lost hope for my extras. No real updates here nor even on the becomemagi site. ANYTHING would be nice. Just let us know what's going on. (Here would be nice since i actually get the updates for this in my email and don't need to go searching and hoping for one on the other stie)
What is the status of "Out of Eden"? I haven't seen anything since the June 26 update. This is the main reason I bought the game...
Hello fellow Magi!
All KS backers should have now received their core sets and archive cases. Asia was just completed.
REWARDS ARES STILL TO COME FOR ALL!
If you have not received your core/archive sets please let us know. Open a ticket with us by sending an email to :
Please do not send a ticket about extras and rewards (compendiums, founders codex, etc)as they are still pending and will be sent out when they are ready. We are only concerned with CORE SETS and ARCHIVE CASES.
I hope everyone is enjoying Serpent's Tongue! More to come very soon!
UK orders went out a while back. I apologize if we missed you. Please send me an email at firstname.lastname@example.org
and include your becomemagi.com id if you have one, and or the email address you used when you ordered so I can locate your information and find out what is holding up your order.
I thought I had done all I needed to pay for necessary delivery costs, are there still delays with my order, when is delivery expected for the UK and what do I need to do/where do I need to go to collect?
Sorry if you've posted this somewhere already, last update I saw was UK stuff being shipped in Jan.
Here is a post from Christopher from our support forum detailing what we have left to do and the order in which we hope to complete everything.
We are working on tweaked rules, and the Avak’Shar cards. Our first priority is the Avak’Shar system. You were all given a lot of Avak’Shar, possess a lot of Avak’Shar code cards, making those worthwhile and following up on our promise that this is not a traditional TCG is number 1.
Two is explaining the new and totally improved rules, game balancing erratas, a more complete glossary. I.e. materials that will help you play, teach & improve the game.
Third is Out of Eden, which required finalization of rules tweaks. Those are now finished and tested so it can now continue its production.
Those are the top three priorities as they effect actually playing the game.
Fourth is Founder’s Codex – with new samples coming in. I did not want to reproduce the 6 ring binder. I don't like it enough for a Deluxe founder’s codex. I like the new samples shots, but I need one in hand to test pocket and binding strength. Those are enroute.
Fifth: Compendium is the last in line. If it takes too much longer, we will just issue refunds for reserved Compendiums. The giant sized compendium we were about to purchase creased and cracked with only light handling, AND it was ridiculously large, it wouldn't even fit in many backpacks. I've gone back to the drawing board on the compendium, trying a new diagram, and I the same company that is doing the new founder’s codexes has some good ideas, although they are still working on the mockups. Fortunately the Compendium will the be shortest to manufacture once its ready.
Hello. I still have yet to receive my two backer's compendiums on top of the extras we were supposed to receive. I am in NA. Is there any updated information in regards to these items? I wasn't sure if the reward packets included those items. Thanks.
We have shipping to Canada again! With a bit of a caveat. We have 10 Master Sets available in Canada. The shipping price in our shopping cart is set to Master sets so if you want to order anything other than a Master's set such as a core set or archive case, etc..please contact us so we can adjust your shipping total accordingly.
Some information about Line For Life.
Line for Life was a limited offering. Line for Life entitles you to every edition and expansion of Serpents Tongue ever made. You will receive at minimum an Archive case of each new card set that is ever produced. You will also receive bonus avakshar to facilitate the replacement of any Errata-ed cards.
As you may or may not know, the Line for Life is considered an investment in Serpent's Tongue and is NON-REFUNDABLE. However, they are TRANSFERABLE! If you no longer wish to have a Line For Life you can sell it to another Magi wishing to obtain this exclusive offering. UnBound will help to facilitate all transactions between Magi to ensure this prestigious benefit is transferred correctly. At this time I do have one Line for Life available to the first responder to this update. Simply send a message to email@example.com stating you wish to purchase the available Line For Life. I will contact you with information about how to conduct the transaction. Hurry! This has only happened once or twice in the past and will likely not happen again soon!
What can I say. Our current helpdesk leaves a LOT to be desired. We are close to having a new system in place which will speed up response time and hopefully stop the burying of tickets. If you are waiting for a response to a ticket we are not ignoring you. I promise! Tickets get buried very easily in our current system and it could go missing for quite a while. I apologize. We will also be adding staff to our helpdesk when the new system is implemented. Trying to bring them on now would only cause mass frustration and lunacy! The last thing we need is another rouge, insane Magi on the loose.
They are en route from China. Christopher is hoping to include the newly revised walkthrough with the rewards packets. Walkthroughs are set to be printed this month and should be ready to go when the packets arrive. So why a new walkthrough you ask?
The new walkthrough is going to actually be a Player's Handbook with assembly instructions, components lists, more interactive solo OR team story based tutorial. An expanded and up to date glossary. A bestiary of new encounters, a list of all rules errata as well as more helpful charts, diagrams and images like an improved casting cycle chart, and other helpful teaching aids!
We will post an Official update when they are ready to ship.
So how did that Avak'Shar Card Shopping cart review go?
Here is the latest ....
AFter 5 MONTHS of bickering with China we negotiated a discount on the printing of Avak’Shar cards, as well as a free NEW printing plate (these are about $1200 a pop) and can now move forward on printing them! Yee ha.
Flare has most of the bones of the code entry AND Avak’Shar Card ‘Shopping Cart’ completed. We will be reviewing it next week.
The Shipping Center for Avak;Shar cards will be set up by Gran Laku Dudeman Dave Borso (our intrepid Customer Service Director). Fulfilling Ava’Shar redemptions in-house has some advantages and disadvantages. In house means cheaper pick pack and shipping rates around the world. BUT it means that Avak’shar redemptions will not stack with other purchases, they are separate. But this will help keep it much more organized.
Before we send the print files to China, we are, as you may know, changing the printing plate of the Specs and Artifacts. This means we get to tweak these cards. We also may have the opportunity to create 4 new cards that will be available only via Avak’Shar. So I have two questions for you:
1. We are on the hunt for ANYONE who has found the following elusive specs. (I havent found these yet.)
The Riley Technique
I would like to adjust these quite dramatically if they are not in wide circulation. Please report your ownership of these Specializations here! link photos if you can!
2. Design Challenge!
Using the art above from Logan Knight, we would like to create a Bonus Avak’Shar only Artifact! What are your ideas? Use the Card Creator to make your own artifact. The art will be uploaded as Codex with Eye so feel free to slap it on there. Link your artifacts here. You can make it any concept you want, a special tome, an upgrade to your current Codex etc…
Any news about pack of KS bonus rewards?
The post from their site is titled "Australia Followup", but it gives some good hope for what all else is left globally. Check out http://www.becomemagi.com/australia-follow/
Two years after the funding it is high time to inform the backers about the rewards still to be shipped (and still to be produced?).
Unbound Games: Please give an update on the status!