Use this space to cheer the creator along, and talk to your fellow backers.
Have a question?
Good morning, everybody!
I am going to try to answer all your questions, both from this comments thread and the one from the update, so this may be a long 'un...
Paul: I stand by the text in the 'risks' section - at least, as far as it goes. Before this project was started, we had a firm plan, we knew how the game was going to work. It was just going to be a case of assembling everything together. Simples. (we really had learned from previous KS projects).
However, the game itself developed, new ideas crept in and, at one point, everything previous was effectively canned in favour of a new direction. We approved this because we could genuinely see it was going to result in a better game - and our mantra throughout this has always been Better Game before Early Delivery.
And that should have been fine too. Obviously other delays pushed us to the point where we are now.
I would therefore humbly submit to you all that what I wrote in that section was true at the time, but is not true now. For that, I apologise, but I still believe it was necessary and I truly think you will agree when you hold the final box set in your hands.
William: For what it is worth, I agree with your assessment of KS projects and their delays. _If_ we were to do another one, I would ensure that it could be done almost purely in-house, and anything required from the outside was done, dusted, and approved before we even mentioned the project.
Art, Point 1: We have not been idle while waiting for the text, and the ground has been prepared for quite some time. What we needed to plan was exactly what got done on which day leading up to final approval.
Art, Point 3: The arrangement was made by James, not us, as part of his overall playtesting. It was not broadcast when it was made, but I honestly do not see a reason for him to have done so.
As for why not let a wider audience delve in, it simply is not ready. It is too raw and there are sections currently in the text that will not be present in the final books. However, out of 4380 people, someone (maybe a lot of someones) will want them to stay - and that would be the Wrong Thing to do. You have to let the guys building the game get on with it without them feeling they are looking over their shoulders (it is the same as writing a novel in this regard). You are going to see a growing number of previews from the game very soon, now that it is in our hands. All will be revealed, but now is most certainly not the right time for public viewing.
I _do_ understand the frustration over this, but if you want Paranoia to be the best it can be, we have to do it this way for now.
Art, Point 4: You mention control, and yes, it has not been in our hands, throughout 2015. Now the ball is back in our court, so is the control. And yes, as I mentioned above, if we were to do this again, it would be different.
John: That is a good question. Right now, this minute, on a Friday morning, I would be tempted to say that if everything now proceeds as has been agreed behind the scenes, it may be better to let sleeping dogs lie. If there is a repetition of previous events, it may well be worth giving them a kick. I do not expect that to happen, as all parties concerned are aware of the consequences. And that is probably all I should say on the matter at this time.
Hobby games and sausages. You don't really want to see how either are made...
Bill: Thank you for that comment. It is also worth pointing out that despite radically shifting circumstances in past projects (looking at you, Dredd), we have yet to let any backer down on a KS, regardless of cost to us.
Kevin: The dice will be produced at the same time as the starter set.
Dennis: We do not expect the approval process (in and of itself) to take any undue time - most alterations will be done in-house (the advantage there is that I can work into the small hours if need be, without getting irate at my boss...), and the PTB have a vested interest in both making sure the game is done and that it matches their own expectations. We are all committed to putting in the required time to do both.
Susan: I understand your frustration with regards to work on Traveller, and I knew that would be an issue when I typed it. However, remember we are a small company that still has to function while work on Paranoia is completed (otherwise nothing comes out for anyone) and the impact to Paranoia really is minor, amounting to no more than a few man-days (or woman-days, as would be more accurate). Four days in the week spent on Paranoia with one day spent shepherding Traveller along is not going to break the bank with the timescales we are now looking at. I hope you can appreciate why things are being done this way.
One last thing - the PTB have given their approval on the first draft of the Player's Book (hurrah!). Mr Rolston has suggested one change that I think will be Most Worthwhile, but it will not affect timescales (in fact, in one sense it may improve them).
Full update a week Monday!
This was the very first game I ever backed on KS! It was the first one I had faith in supporting, reading how close it was to being finished I was confident it would be finished on time. Since then I've backed 15 other projects, all board games and RPG's.. This is the ONLY one that I've not received yet. First to back, last to deliver. So I'm not convinced huge delays are the norm with KS, I think this project has been exceptionally bad. I too hope we get some clarity on exactly why things are so far behind, particularly when it was claimed to be nearly ready for print in the Risks and Challenges section right from the start. Don't get me wrong I'm still excited about the game but the huge delays and lack of communication will always leave a bitter taste in my mouth.
At this point, the most positive thing I can say is that I also backed Dawning Star: Fate of Eos, Red Aegis, Timewatch, and Storm Hollow, and all of those are worse. You're not to the "Storm Hollow" stage yet, but being told that the project is going to be even further behind because the company is putting resources behind a different project is making me lump Mongoose in with the folks behind those other projects in terms of my willingness to back you in the future.
@Bill Wilson: I don't think it's fair to say that just because a minority of people are commenting, a minority of people didn't know and accept the risk.
A better metric would be how many people have backed RPGs on Kickstarter before (and therefore knew to expect the apparently inevitable delays). This is the first time I'm doing so, and I actually would have laid quite a bit of money on the game being no more than a month late. While I didn't know much about Mongoose, given that it was a name that I knew, I figured that they had to be pretty successful and organized: they've been around for a while and they haven't gone under. They also reassured me that they'd left plenty of extra time to "account for any unforeseen hiccups that arise during development".
Furthermore, there are loads of reasons that someone might not be okay with the delays and not be commenting: laziness and having forgotten about the project are the two big ones. I had forgotten about the project until a few months ago when it autocompleted in my address bar (it wasn't like there were a lot of updates to remind me about it) and forgetting about Kickstarters is pretty common, at least among my circle of friends: every now and again someone will get something in the mail they had no real idea was coming.
I suspect that believers are in the overwhelming minority. Most people are putting money up because they expect that promises will be fulfilled: not out of some sense of patronage of the arts.
@Boris Barkovic: I would agree that most people were swayed to contribute because of the exclusive kickstarter content. I suspect that the heart of the reason was the love of Paranoia to begin with. As fan of paranoia I am most excited about this being a fresh reboot, and not a rehash or cleaning of the previous systems. The prospect of getting a shinny new version, more current gaming concepts, and easily accessible to the budding gamers (read kids) i have sitting around the table is truly exciting. If this system can be as exciting to the new and the already indoctrinated then it will well be worth the wait. The extra's are just the dessert toppings, or the cherry on top.
As for the buyer vs believer, I am a believer. I knew the risk when I took it. I would tend to say that the majority of the 4300+ backers also did based on having less than 300 unique contributors to these comments. I will choose to believe that it will come and be awesome.
If you could provide a yes/no answer to this question, it would be greatly appreciated.
Will we have the full explanation of why the campaign has run so far behind before it ends?
I don't want an explanation of the answer (although that would be great!). I have been very careful to make this question as easy to answer as is possible, because it wasn't captured in your last comment. I just want a straight yes or no, so I can adjust my expectations accordingly.
1. 'Our artsy people are pouring over the draft files as I type, brainstorming ideas, plotting out timelines for work, and generally figuring out how to put the awesome into the presentation of the Paranoia box set.' - HANG ON.... Didn't you JUST give timelines for sending the product to print? Yet here you say 'plotting out timelines' - so which is the incorrect statement, or did this all get sorted in record time??
2. We have a new face in the approval/tweaking department, one that will be very familiar to those of you who are Paranoia veterans - all will be revealed in the next proper update! - Very welcome he is as well....
3. We appreciate some of you might feel a bit raw over someone seeing the draft files before all of you. This was a prior arrangement/promise and, in our view, the draft files are not fit for wider viewing yet. We will be sorting out some deeper and more revealing previews in the very near future, but please allow us to make sure they are worthy of more than just an Infrared clone (bear in mind that these files have only just come in and _I_ haven't read everything yet...). - See, this I just don't believe one bit. 'Prior arrangement' - now, far be it from the ONLY truth, or avenue of communication, but I looked back 6 months on the feeds of both gentlemen... and guess what? No mention of this 'prior arrangement' before January 21, 2016.
That's a little over 2 weeks ago.
Not very long.
Apart from this (which may be totally innocent and with no malice of forthought), if even YOU haven't read through the files, why allow them to be looked at by a member of the public?? This is madness, sheer madness.
Or total ineptitude - I can't make my mind up... As for 'the draft files are not fit for wider viewing yet' - How about you let US be the judge of that? After all, if one person has seen, what's the harm in letting your financial backers see the progress made?
4. There have obviously been some issues in the background that have caused significant delays. - Well, if nothing else, it will make for interesting reading in my Directors Edition....
I'm still not convinced that you're in control of the process here - this isn't your first rodeo, and far from your last I would assume.
It's been mentioned elsewhere that it's almost traditional now for KS Campaigns to run late - this 'reduction of expectations' is worringly common, but should not be the norm.
I backed this campaign because I thought the timescales looked OK to me - I read the risks, saw that it looked like the organisers had learned their lessons (it even says that in the campaign notes).. If It had said 'Summer / Autumn 2016' I probably wouldn't have backed, and would have waited for the Retail version.
This behaviour, is generally called 'lying' at best, 'obtaining funds by deception' at it's worst.
Now I'm not saying that Mongoose deceived it's backers, but it certainly wasn't entirely honest...
Still, I look forward to the next update.
"You can be simultaneously excited for the game and critical of how the campaign is being handled. Dismissing complaints as illegitimate just because most Kickstarters run late isn't fair: the status quo isn't automatically the right thing to do."
Well said, but sadly I think there is now a KS culture where delivery dates are actually (at least) 6 months after what is claimed. Late delivery has gone from prevalent to expected to accepted.
As someone who has to meet deadlines as part of my job, I understand and am sympathetic to situations where late deliveries have been due to unforeseen circumstances or even just good faith error. These things happen. But I become concerned as I see more and more of a "well this project is ONLY 6 months late" attitude percolating throughout KS. Instead of on-time or early projects setting the bar for other projects, they become dismissed as the outlying cases.
"Following this, we are currently projecting the core box set to be complete and ready for print at the end of April, which would mean getting a delivery from the printers at the end of June/beginning of July.
Now, please note, this does not take into account any approvals process or tweaking requested from the PTB. We are already running material past the PTB and making requested changes on the fly so, in theory, the approvals process runs alongside our art and layout and we can quickly get the green light when the files are complete. Therefore, again in theory, the approval process adds little or no time to development (this is the same process we ran for Traveller, recently re-released)."
Given their current record, I'd say we can expect to see this game January 2017 at best.
From the Kickstarter blurb ' in short, we have done as much as we possibly can short of actually producing the game.'
Okay, I understand that delays happen, but come on. This sentence invokes images of products ready to be sent off to the printers, I didn't realise that it actually meant you still had to actually write the book. (what you 'playtested' is likely nothing like what you have now).
We are now a year after when you predicted the books would be sent to the printers. I know delays happen, and I have backed many projects that have been delayed, but 12 months on a product supposedly so near completion is just unacceptable. I'll certainly think twice before I back on Kickstarter again.
@John Harvey: Thank you, that's exactly, and you put it much better than I did.
@Matthew Sprange: Thank you for the updates, and I hope "diplomacy" doesn't strain too much the relationships between you guys. Publishing is hard, and I'm sure your KS will be better managed. :-)
Little on-topic segway, not specific to Mongoose:
TL;DR: (long version follows) Sellers lie and TRY to make the lies true ; buyers know the sellers lie and HOPE sellers make the lies true. In the end, it's still workers getting an advance and running the risk of not putting the work in because they already have the money AND that nobody can take that money away. The fact that it all is "voluntary and not really contractual, because you know, it's completely unenforceable" makes it a real lesson in risk management on both parts.
The long version:
@Frederick and others: I think that this highlights the weirdly unregulated nature of Kickstarters : they're basically a license to consensually lie. Now I'm not saying that the project leaders ("sellers") *have* to lie, but the KS system encourages them to do that, and they expect KS participants to accept the lies as a "seductive storefront" while knowing deeply that it's just theater and that reality may be very different.
Let me explain. According to KS rules, an organizer has two very different tools to entice participants to give them money:
- a project description,
- one-time "rewards" (as opposed to a stake in the project).
The KS site emphasizes that the project leaders' actual manufacture and sending of the rewards are purely voluntary, that the exchange of money is NOT a contract, and that the participants are not buying a product, but financing a project they believe in, hence the existence of the "I don't want a reward" choice. What is the percentage of people who chose that? I don't have any numbers, but I expect it is pretty low. Most people in KS do want exclusives, KS special add-ons, previews and early adopter products. Most people who participate in Kickstarters are indeed BUYERS, albeit very patient and forgiving ones. Honestly, would you preorder a product from any regular vendor a year ahead, see the due date slip by, have little to no information and still expect the product six month to a year later?
For people to be willing to give money, the KS rewards have to be interesting, somewhat exclusive, and on the whole, the buyer has to believe he's got a bargain. That usually means some creativity on the leaders' part and perhaps thinner margins.
The project description often contains smilies, exclamation marks, enthusiasm and hyperbole, which the KS FAQ says has to be counterbalanced with possible pitfalls, "foreseeable imponderables" and so on. Thing is, OF COURSE the project won't write "we have nothing yet but it's gonna be huge", or most people will turn away (ok, SOME projects can do that, but only IF they've build a reputation for making good on their promises).
If KS was regulated, most badly managed projects would fail miserably. As it is, well... it's a matter of trust. If you want a product you (factually) paid for and your only recourse for getting it is shouting... it's not absurd to want to shout.
As for the argument that most RPG products are late, that's a non-argument. A late product is a late product; if "traditions" say that most product tend to be late, those traditions suck and have to be changed.
I was so stuck on delivering my comment properly that I missed the mini update!!
Could someone point me to the nearest termination booth?
I agree with Matt and Frederick. We got some good news- the game is in the publishers hands. Matthew says that they are having a meeting to plan what happens next. (It could mean that they are trying to make the two fronts of the pronged attack meet, that some things in the game design caught them by surprise and now they have to change things, or even to decide what goes to the Red lv. box and what goes to the UV lv. box. The options are endless.) Matthew also promised at least one update every 2 weeks. So maybe we should wait for that before crying out. And not bombard automatically, just because we don't like how things went until now.
Don't get me wrong, I am thankful that the backers who speak their disapproval do so. It gets the attention of the project creator and reminds him that we are still here. (Instead of going through long moments of silence.) And it helps to see that you are not the only one frustrated about the delays. But I think that maybe we should see what was decided at the meeting (today I think).
About giving the raw material to Dragontologist, that is also annoying. Yet I trust the publisher, and I supported this game also because I hope that my help could make it better.
Looking forward for more frequent updates (please keep us in the loop), and to playing the game (obviously).
Good morning, everyone!
I'll do a 'proper' update later, so consider this a 'mini' update, together with some answers to questions that have popped up here this week...
1. Our artsy people are pouring over the draft files as I type, brainstorming ideas, plotting out timelines for work, and generally figuring out how to put the awesome into the presentation of the Paranoia box set.
2. We have a new face in the approval/tweaking department, one that will be very familiar to those of you who are Paranoia veterans - all will be revealed in the next proper update!
3. We appreciate some of you might feel a bit raw over someone seeing the draft files before all of you. This was a prior arrangement/promise and, in our view, the draft files are not fit for wider viewing yet. We will be sorting out some deeper and more revealing previews in the very near future, but please allow us to make sure they are worthy of more than just an Infrared clone (bear in mind that these files have only just come in and _I_ haven't read everything yet...).
4. There have obviously been some issues in the background that have caused significant delays. We obviously did not foresee these and we could have pulled the plug on one line of development and started afresh at several points - however, we were confident that the final result would be Most Awesome and worthy of Paranoia, which put us in a sticky position. There obviously had to be a limit on our patience (and yours) but if we waited just another month (and another, and another...) then we could see we would be getting what would very much be the next generation of Paranoia, not just a rehash, which we felt would be the last thing we could do. That is why a degree of paralysis crept into the project. I am aware that there were a dozen different things we could do, but I am still sure that, in terms of delivering a truly new edition of Paranoia, following this particular path was the right one.
zarathud: if you're going to share the files with someone, why not the people who put forward money so the project could get made in the first place? We'd all be happy to test and provide feedback.
The issue isn't a delay in production: it's a feeling that if someone was going to get the files, it should have been us, and that if the files are going to be handed out, we should be included.
I disagree that the files shouldn't be shared -- a little more testing and outside feedback won't keep Mongoose from working to finish Paranoia.
Again, my standpoint is that Mongoose went into this situation hiring a person they knew had their own Kickstarter that was a year behind, one that is now 2+ years behind, and did not take that as a warning sign. So I think that opens them up for criticism.
And I'm in agreement with Art: so the day after the files get turned in, someone just asks for them and they get shared, all because of a prior agreement while the people that helped provide the money to get it into its final form don't get to see a thing...that doesn't sit right, prior agreement or not.
You can be simultaneously excited for the game and critical of how the campaign is being handled. Dismissing complaints as illegitimate just because most Kickstarters run late isn't fair: the status quo isn't automatically the right thing to do.
We all understand that game design takes time: it's just that we were told it would taken significantly less time, and that the original data given had plenty of time to "account for any mishaps or delays along the way". This obviously wasn't the case, and wanting an explanation for that isn't unreasonable. The reason there's so much anger is because this isn't the first time we've asked for such an explanation, and had the question entirely ignored.
Matthew: is there an ongoing need for diplomacy? Will we ever have the full explanation of why the campaign has run so far behind? If the answer to that question is a 'no', that's okay, but a straight answer would be appreciated and go a long way to making me feel like you understand how we're feeling. I understand that it's a small community and that you can't go around badmouthing people, but I feel like we're owed at least something of an explanation. We put money forward to make this happen. We're part of the project. Make us feel like it.
If dragontologist can have the files, why not send them to us? Let us see where the game is.
To be clear, that isn't a rhetorical question. Some person on the internet has asked for the files, and been told they will receive them. Is there a good reason we can't all have the files? If so, what is it?
Thank you @Matt Lee. Tired of seeing comments sections on Kickstarters taken over by people who Arles annoyed, while the majority silently wait for their rewards. Now the documents have been received I'm sure we'll see progress towards the final product. I for one am looking forward to it. Great game design and good writing take time, and editing and layout more so. Patience is a virtue and will pay dividends. Let Matthew get on with his job now, which is ensuring the books get done, rather than firefighting rather aggressive commentary.
Man, you guys have got to calm down. The final product will come when it comes. I get the feeling you'll be more busy talking about the things that happened during this that annoyed you than actually playing the bloody game.
Keep at it, Matthew, I'm excited to see Paranoia when it's done!
And he has far more than we do at this point.
Polished or not, still pretty ridiculous and disappointing.
Art: Got it, thank you. This was a prior arrangement and, when it was first agreed upon, the files should have been with us long before - obviously did not end up that way. I should stress, all he has are the raw files, not what I would call a complete and certainly not a polished game.
As for IP protection and torrenting - no, just no. The IP remains solidly with Eric and Greg, and in our experience, trust like that is not abused.
https://twitter.com/dragontologist/status/694524588169019392 - try this.
It appears to be that 'dragontologist' wishes to run Paranoia at a Con - James has kindly sent him the files which he has provided to you.
Now, apart from the fact that these appear to have been freely given prior to backers seeing the damn things, where's the IP protection? What's to stop 'dragontologist' torrenting the hell out of these? Should I ask HIM for the game I've paid you for?
Sorry Art, I may be going blind, or I may just be bad at Twitter - what am I looking for?
Mr Sprange - I suggest you check Mr Wallis' twitter feed.
Boris: I understand and agree with everything you are saying. All I can really say at this point was that a certain amount of diplomacy was required on our part, which limited the updates we could make. There were, obviously, problems behind the scenes, but we were also confident that if they could be managed, Paranoia was going to be everything we had hoped for and more. All that said, now we have the manuscripts in hand, the ball is firmly in our court (approvals aside, but Eric and Greg have a vested interest in not just making sure that Paranoia is the best it can be, but that it also actually appears) we can get properly moving.
Oh, and I understand the Peter Molyneux thing - nice guy, lots of vision, but seems to have developed a bit of a reputation.
Art... what are you talking about? Tell me, and I may be able to help...
NOW THIS IS BLOODY ANNOYING.
WHY is James Wallis being allowed to send out the files which we, your backers have yet to see? Yes, the person who is being sent them 'appears' to be working a convention, so it's good publicity for your company, but seriously - have you no shame??
Seriously pissed now... you may want to have a bloody good think on why this is.
Boris hits the nail on the head.
I suggest that form the next update on, Mr Sprange drops the 'in game' style and keeps it perfectly plain, honest and factual.
If you want to see how quickly you can lose a small community, take a look at Palladium...
You really don't want to be on the receiving end of that level of heat do you Mr Sprange?
I love Paranoia, I've played it for many years and I believe a new edition is both needed and welcome. Paranoia XP is, in my opinion, one of the best self-contained RPG core books I have read.
Now, I will be harsh, but at that point no-one seems to care.
(Also, English is not my first language, apologies in advance.)
@Dennis: I fully agree with you, Art and others. The problem with this kind of lies is that they become apparent only if you get caught, like in this instance. Lying about the books being nearly ready would have been fine IF they could actually have written them according to the schedule: nobody would have noticed and credibility would not have been lost.
@Matthew Sprange :
Could you please stop with all the PR talk? Three points :
- The RPG community is tiny and you already have quite a bit of money from us; being repeatedly vague only makes you and Mongoose look extremely unprofessional. We understand that we are not actual investors (as Kickstarter keeps reminding us in its FAQ), that you can legally do whatever you want with our money and we would have no recourse... but honestly, don't you think there has been enough bullshit already? This is not Hollywood, we're giving you a hundred pounds for a ROLEPLAYING GAME. Fairness and openness will get you much, MUCH more from us (simple positive word of mouth, sometimes actual publicity, and last but not least: implicit trust in your upcoming campaigns) than talking to us like a used car salesman.
- If you don't know what to do and how to do it, take a look at (for instance) the Onix Path guys: THAT is how you do a KS campaign. Specific deadlines, AT LEAST bi-monthly status updates (Onyx Path does it via their newsletter, but KS updates are even better), percentages, etc. Late manuscripts and production snafus are expected, but that's exactly what you have to take into account when you initially set due dates, and if they DO happen, YOU TELL PEOPLE WHAT HAPPENED AND WHY, instead of "oh, commies are at it again". This is not the Alpha Complex, we're in the real world and you have our real money.
- The relationship you may have with your writers is *your* problem. I know you understand that because you are being as vague as possible about James Wallis' late manuscripts, however you do appear as a hostage and a victim here. That's insane: you are not only the publisher of the game, but also the name behind the Kickstarter campaign. He may look like a confused and badly organised author, but as far as money goes... you're the one accountable. It's a KS so it's fine but with actual investors, other, less fortunate words start flying: fraud, embezzlement, etc. I'm not trying to paint you as a gangster, but you're not doing yourself any favours by basically telling us that you don't know how far along the product YOU are carrying is.
- Mongoose is an established company, with many game lines and quite a few licenses. You did not NEED a KS campaign, but by doing one you made promises to others and not only to yourselves, and it is perfectly legitimate of your backers to call you out on *repeated* broken promises and a lack of communication. "Be courteous" is nice and all, but we're not fools: treat us well and we'll be civil, otherwise you can expect more and more discontents with little patience for witless banter and empty updates.
You seem like a nice guy trying to give new life to a product you believe in, which is great.
You don't want to be known as the Peter Molyneux of tabletop gaming. If you don't know who that is, google him and read up on the Godus video game debacle.
We trust you. We have to, but some of us, probably many of us want to. :-)
"We have done much of the design groundwork and playtesting of the new Paranoia already, the printers have been primed, and our distribution system is already set to ship the final box sets to you - in short, we have done as much as we possibly can short of actually producing the game."
Had that statement not been in their campaign,I would.have been more forgiving and understanding for the long delay.
Let's be honest,we were lied to in order to get our funds. I'm hoping for a decent game but the game was never in a state that where it was ready to go to the printers as they basically stated above.
I'm cool with games that have delays when I know they're making the game from scratch. But when you're told that everything is ready and here's our 5-6/month plan to release, you assume you're being told the truth.
Never again will I be tricked and deceived into backing their stuff. I'll forgo any KS exclusives and keep my money until the product arrives.
You can burn through goodwill only once before you burn that bridge.
Now to adding the awesome!
Repeatedly checking for the update.
Just walked into the office, I have some good news (a couple of bits, actually), but let me settle down and I will do a proper update within the next few hours...
So, it's February, how about that update on EXACTLY where every element of the project is? I'd like dates, hards deadlines, timescales, basically a full breakdown of what is done, what is left to be done, when it'll be done and how you intend to make sure it all happens.
We started hosting board game nights at our house quite regularly about two years ago. We decided at some point to get an RPG that was pretty light-hearted, short, and generally accessible. So I heard about Paranoia, lamented how old it was, and then was elated to discover the Kickstarter. We had backed a few Kickstarter board games before that did finish on time, so we went for this one.
A year and a half later, we're still playing board games . . .
James Wallis: 'Today I was hyped that jetsetradio;live simply existed. Today I'm hyped that it's so freakishly good. Music for game designing'
Art Steventon: 'Talking of which, what's the update on Paranoia? Any further or are you still 'tripping & smashing your face?'
James Wallis: 'Should be done tomorrow'..
And that's all she wrote folks...
Does he mean the update or the game will be done tomorrow??
Word from Mr Wallis is, when asked about the update via Twitter (which he frequents quite a bit) that 'It should be done tomorrow'....
From the updates and from Mr. Sprange's comments, it really makes it look like Mr. Sprange is at the mercy of Mr. Wallis. Mr. Wallis' comment at the end of the last update, "let's see how that goes, really came across to me as a bit flippant.
I also hope we get a full accounting of the project and not just a cut and paste from Mr. Wallis. Although I imagine we are going to be in a holding pattern until Mr. Wallis is tracked down for comment, once again.
Well, we're one day off the end of the month and...
What. A. Surprise.
I think at this point, Mr Sprange needs to give a FULL account of where the project is, piece by piece.
No excuses, no pithy comments, just a straight up 'we're at X point with book 1, Y point with book 2'.
Seriously. I think I'm not alone in saying patience has now run out with Messrs Wallis & Sprange. Time to face the music boys.
Joshua's post has prompted me to look again..
Let's take a look at that very passage upon the campaign:
1) 'We have run several Kickstarter projects before, both successful and otherwise, and while we have not made every mistake possible, we have made a lot!
Fortunately, we learn from our mistakes and have yet to repeat any.' - Then why is the completion of the campaign as late as those for Rogue Trooper and Judge Dredd? Were lessons really learned? I think not!
2)'We have done much of the design groundwork and playtesting of the new Paranoia already, the printers have been primed, and our distribution system is already set to ship the final box sets to you - in short, we have done as much as we possibly can short of actually producing the game.' Oh dear... did your mother never tell you not to tell fibs?
3) 'James is leading a design team that has been working on the new Paranoia for the past year or so, and a great deal has already been completed - if something tragic were to happen, we have made sure everything is already in place for the design team to complete the project, on schedule.', Oh dear, Hubris is never a nice thing... however, are we being too harsh on Mr Wallis? Where are the others in this 'design team', or was it a case that said team was never put in place? Do play testers count as 'design staff'?
4)'We are planning to send the game to print in February, expecting it back in March/April - however we have set the 'official' delivery date for June, in order to account for any mishaps or delays along the way.' - Oh dear....
5)That said, the most likely thing to go wrong here is for James to be lynched by his underlings... - Still a possibility...
still, we're a few days off the 'end of the month' - shall we see an update? or an update to tell us we're getting an update?
I await with baited breath...
Hmmm... have to agree that the risks and challenges section is quite misleading... I'm glad I never read it before but now i do feel a bit... disheartened.
Lol yeah I hadn't read that since before I pledged... Really contradicts everything we have been told over the past year
I for one am still excited about the campaign and look forward to it shipping. It does however seem that the risks and challenges section in the campaign details had a much rosier view of what reality really was.
Almost sounds the the setting of a Paranoia scenario.
Art: The position we are at right now is that we are waiting for James to deliver the manuscripts for the box set at the end of this month. I understand your frustration (I share it) but I cannot truthfully tell you more than that.
So the right time would be when? 201 ? 2018? Because going by Mongoose's record at delivering completed KS campaigns, that would be a conservative estimate.
Just be honest and tell your backs the exact truth - a position statement of where you are at RIGHT NOW (not where you hope to be, not where you will be once you have tracked down whatever information is currently errant) would go a long way to allay any concerns many of your backs have.
Art: If the complete text turns up at month's end, then misleading may be an unfair term. If you are asking me whether I am happy with the situation, then no, I am not. But please understand that today is not the right time to do anything that might be regretted later.
Matthew: I am fully aware of who posted the comments. However, I ask you whether you were in agreement that they are in fact, misleading (hence my previous 'Jam Tomorrow' comment).
Repeatedly saying 'we'll know more by XX' merely leads one to believe that yet again your backers, who are financially invested in this project, have no reason to have confidence in either your ability to manage your writers ability to produce to a deadline, nor the project overall.
I apologise if that sound combative, but working in project management I know good management when I see it - and right now? I see nothing.