Use this space to cheer the creator along, ask questions, and talk to your fellow backers. Please remember to be respectful and considerate. Thanks!
How I can refund my money back please?
Yup, Joyeux Noël à tous ! Minus 2 of course.
Hope you liars have a good Christmas!
Nice idea Drew,
Merry Christmas to everybody here. Well, everybody- 2 of course ;-)
Just wanted to wish everyone in here a Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukah, Kwanza, etc... we may have all been scammed by this jerk, but at least we're in this together! :D
If people stumble on this page by chance, you will find a good summary in this article : http://observer.com/2015/06/botched-1m-kickstarter-cst-01-had-another-secret-investment-made-up-van-sob-story/
How CST-01 team will have a good Christmas Holidays with all our money!
Just saying that not everyone here have money to waste, a**holes!
This projector keep reminds me that KS is a bullshit.
So, is this project officially done?
I hope you two were thankful for all of the money you stole from the backers. I am sure your family is proud of you.
i think kickstarter is also a complete fraud and would suggest my friends to stay away from this platform.
Another KS scam - post to twitter and let the world know.
Do not use KS.
So here we are some 90 - 180 days later. How did the liquidation process go? As the anger slowly but surely fades the disappointment in eyeryone involved with this project grows. From Kickstarter to the project creators to the people running the so called CST Creditors Trust. The only one i trust is the higher being - lets call it fate - that will do the justice ... as no one of the aforementioned human beings will stand their ground. Thank you for a lesson learned.
There is no stock Lars. They supposedly spent the money for thousands of parts but cant even show a picture of them.
If there are no parts then where is the money?
I have a pretty good idea.
I submitted the form that you guys set out what feels like ages ago now, all I want are the components to make the watch, regardless of whether I'd be able to make it properly. I want to give making the watch a try.
Please send me the parts, I know you guys must have some stock on hand, some people got their watches.
it's incredible that these liars and thieves cannot be punished by laws of the United States. These liars and thieves can be easily human flesh searched and taken to the justice even in China. Where are the greatest laws of the USA?
I had totally forgotten about this campaign of theft. Surprised to see the page is still active; I would have thought kickstarter would have hidden its shame like an ugly relative in the basement.
Long live the CST thieves; pricks better have gotten something really pretty with my $
Soooo... where is my watch ?
Unfortunately, yes, it looks like the the CST crooks have won because it took too long for the Illinois AG and FTC to take action :( It'll be up to us to warn others about any future projects these guys get involved in and also Kickstarter's lack of support.
Is that how those guys won?
@ Robert Russell: I agree with you completely. I'm done backing projects that have HIGH expectations or are for any sort of technology unless it is from a creator that has had plenty of previous successes like PLX Devices.
@innocrave : Buccaneer 3d printer and CST-01 in the same article! http://www.androidauthority.com/6-crowdfunded-devices-were-still-waiting-for-703433/
I just came to kick starter to see abt my Buccaneers 3D printer to be disappointed $497 lost. Went through some more projects I backed to be disappointed 3 more times almost $1k lost in Kickstarter wow.
Anyone got an answer from the ftc? Not talking about the letter they sent to everyone...
Heck, at this point, I don't know why I'm even commenting on this. But...
I'm completely done with crowdfunding and Kickstarter -- and buying anything retail from a Kickstarter-funded company, since I've been waiting 14 months for my Sesame lock.
One thought if you want blood for their $129: civil lawyers want something of value they can go after, and I sense Dave & Jerry have far less cash than Ben & Jerry. Even if they're personally liable, it's easy to declare personal bankruptcy. Neither one is showing his Tesla on Facebook ... although Jerry isn't going by "Jerry" anymore.
Now, if someone in China can prove that there was a coordinated fraud and no parts were ever bought, perhaps the Illinois AG or DOJ will get interested in criminal Fraud charges, since this could be a politically positive case. But that would require someone entering a Flextronics or contractor plant to photograph empty boxes or copy paperwork, not likely.
If you're continuing to pursue restitution and justice, I wish you luck and thank you for your efforts. I'm outta here.
At one time I said this project look like a scam, after that another backer replayed "I can believe you call this a scam" o something like that. My question to that backer is, Do you believe you were not scam? I'm sorry that so many of us were let down.
Well, paypal is removing their "buyers protection" from payments toward crowdfunding projects:
If you ever wanted to know on how big a scale scamming is going on in crowdfunding, there you have it: paypal loses enough money to react to this, so it must be a lot higher than the in the single digit millions.
Im practically done with crowdfunding, this project was the last nail in the coffin.
I never received anything from this project. it's a sham. they took my money and I never recieved anything from them.
Kickstarter are refusing to confirm to me which legal entity they transferred the money to. It looks as though the money we paid was to David Vondle and Jerry O’Leary 'trading as' Central Standard Design, which was not a limited liability entity - therefore they are still both personally responsible for the funds.
Please ask Kickstarter to confirm the entity yourselves. They're being very obstructive in clarifying.
@Trogdor wouldn't be surprised if something similar happened with CST. They can't exactly prove they ever purchased any of the components.
Interesting read about another KS campaign where someone used money to build their house...
I'm not a lawyer but I believe there is enough evidence to hold Dave Vondle and Jerry O'Leary accountable. Not only did they mismanage the project, they misspent funds, went against the will of the backers, and intentionally deceived us from the very start of the campaign. I'd love to believe that they were bumbling idiots, but their actions show intent at a malicious level.
@Jordan. Although i'm skeptical of eventual success I've submitted a claim at the FTC today.
Thanks and regards.
"Complaint has been submitted
Today 7:48 PM
Complaint Submitted - Your reference number is:
Thank you for contacting the Federal Trade Commission. We have given your complaint the reference number listed above. Please use that reference number if you need to contact us about your complaint in the future.
Once we have reviewed your complaint, you may receive another email with additional information that may further assist you."
I don't understand why they need my social to "clear up this debt". Sounds like a load of bollocks to me. That said, I found the owner of CRA on Linkedin, in case any of you want to reach out to him... https://www.linkedin.com/in/bob-handler-529134
@Jordan. Thanks for the links. Unable to complain to AG as the forum only supports US addresses. FTC complaint lodged.
I'm keen to establish whether the liquidation paperwork is valid. The payment receipt is made out to 'Central Standard Design', which is presumably the name Dave Vondle and Jerry O'Leary, it certainly doesn't appear to have been a registered limited liability entity, and we've not agreed to have their obligations transferred over to a limited entity, therefore I am wondering if Dave Vondle and Jerry O'Leary should still be personally responsible. Any thoughts?
Let's keep the pressure on these liars:
Everyone, if you haven't already done so please fill out complaints to the Illinois Attorney General and FTC.
Illinois Attorney General Consumer Complaint On-Line Submission Form: https://ccformsubmission.ilattorneygeneral.net/
FTC Complaint: https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov Select "Internet services, online shopping, or computers" then "Online shopping"
Seller/Provider: Dave Vondle and Jerry O'Leary doing business as Central Standard Timing
Address: 3039 W Fullerton Ave # 2
Chicago, IL 60647-2807
The legal entity named on the liquidation paperwork doesn't match the entity named on the payment receipts and Kickstarter are refusing to even confirm what entity they distributed our collected funds too. Absolute joke on behalf of the Kickstarter team, to really rub salt into the wound.
@Laird Popkin - Seriously, after all the lies and BS CST has told us so far, you choose to believe that fiction about them being able to deliver a slightly thicker watch? It was a rigged survey that the majority of backers didn't have proper notice to respond to. I want an accounting of how they mismanaged our money. For all I know, they took nice vacations with a portion of our KS funds instead of efficiently using it to complete the project.
did they burn through money?
What do they have to show for?
Supposedly thousands of displays, bands and batteries, but no proof or even picture that these ever existed. How strange is that?
The survey was concluded before everybody had a chance to vote... It might have been just part of a plot to pretend to have gone bankrupt because of factors outside their control, when in fact they funneled out the money from the project right into their own pockets.
Thats a common trick and Kickstarter isn't to blame for other people's criminal energy.
However they could be blamed for not having stricter rules or otherwise supporting the people who make their business possible in case things go south.
Even ebay which is also just a platform, refunds for frauds, misrepresentations and blocks sellers for much smaller offenses. Ebay sells only existing products? Well, I ordered a flute which had shipping of 4 weeks. Thats acceptable. However after paying I got a message that the person will get to making it within the next 20 days. Lol. Almost like our 2 CST founders here the person had pretended that the product was ready to go. Just revisit the CST campaign page for fun. Prototype and assembly working, supply figured out and all it needs is money for the parts. Lying from the beginning. Planned to fail to hide the money stolen from us or just "Fake it until you not make it"?
I don't blame Kickstarter - they're basically just a service allowing projects to advertise and collects funds. And this project was entirely doable. The failure came, I think, when they refused to make the watch that was slightly thicker than originally promised - that they could have delivered that a year or two ago, and it would have been an awesome watch! Instead they pursued impossible perfection, burning through all of the money and running up a huge debt.
That being said, as I recall they ran a survey and the community strongly preferred to wait for a thinner watch, so I suppose you could blame the backers for being unwilling to compromise.
But whoever you want to blame for that decision, they compounded it by burning through the money that should have been reserved for manufacturing the watches. Once they did that, which has to have started a LONG time ago, they had to know that they couldn't deliver, and they should have pulled the plug. Continuing, and hoping that an investor would dig them out, was I believe unethical. Instead, they should have either made the slightly thicker watch that was actually manufacturable, or shut down and given back whatever was left. Instead, by unwisely continuing, they've not only delivered NOTHING to their investors (i.e. us), they ended up still being over $900K in personal debt, which they may never recover from.
Saw this link in the news today. Have lost all faith in the Kickstarter platform.
Being burned more than once.
Given the course of events, I'm not inclined to give these jokers my SSN. I think I'll follow the advice of others and hold off on my claim. I doubt it would lead to a refund anyway. Instead of filling out their form I used the time to file complaints with the FTC and Illinois Attorney General.
If you recently got the email from them (or from commercial recovery associates) DO NOT MAIL IN THE FORM! This is yet another scam. You will NOT get your $ back and worse yet CRA will sell your address and info to other companies! Look on their website and it's obvious they are on CST's side, not ours! Feel free to re-post this so everyone knows.
We might've been looking at just a photo realistic 3D model in a picture here :/
Ктоньть объяснит мне смысл сего документа?
I hope you get fucked in the bottom and have to use all the stolen money to repair the arsehole.
We know that CST have proven themselves to be liars (remember that BS about living in a van on the parking lot of Flextrionics trying to get this watch finished, only to get outed by Flextronics when they said it never happened?) If they could prove that every cent of our money was used for legitimate purposed in making this watch a reality, and they just couldn't overcome the technical problems that exacerbated their inexperience/incompetence, then I would be OK with that and chalk this up to an honest loss. But these jokers never gave a true accounting of what they did with over a million dollars, and by choosing to put themselves through this assignment of debt (rather than bankruptcy, which would have subjected them to court procedures that forces them to give a detailed and accurate accounting of the money spent) continues their behavior of not giving full disclosure as to how our funds were (mis)used. This is what frustrates me most and is why we should still continue to hold their feet to the fire once the Trustee finished this assignment.
"Burns! " - nope, I did not receive a watch. Nor have any of my friends who also backed this project. These guys are scumbags for taking the money and running.