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Camelot Unchained is a counter-revolutionary RvR-focused MMORPG from Mark Jacobs and CSE set in a post-apocalyptic yet familiar world.
Camelot Unchained is a counter-revolutionary RvR-focused MMORPG from Mark Jacobs and CSE set in a post-apocalyptic yet familiar world.
14,873 backers pledged $2,232,933 to help bring this project to life.

Evening Update April 16, 2013

Posted by City State Entertainment (Creator)


It’s been another great day here at CSE.  First, we got more ducks!  So thank you Matthew Kramer for those little quackers.  Secondly, our backers continue to prove why they are the best backers in Kickstarter by not only their generosity but also by their participation in the non-stop chat channel formerly known as our comment section.  We have over 28K comments there already and we’re not even halfway through our campaign.  Amazing!  Finally, we have something very cool to show you, a new and rather interesting race for Camelot Unchained.  Rather than spend a lot of time blathering on about it, here are some wonderful pieces of concept art, which are only part of what you’ll see in today’s video update. 

As always, my thanks and deepest gratitude to all of you. 


P.S. Andrew worked some more tech magic. Another build of our engine is coming this week.

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    1. Oshunsar on

      love it!
      play it...

    2. Janne Merioksa on

      .. velociraptor ..

    3. Janne Merioksa on

      Those wings suddenly make more sense, if you imagine the creature to dash forward with 4 pedals, or partially so, like a Raptor.

      With the long legs, the wings would be at the highest point of the body, and she being thick on the legs and hip, they're connected to the largest volume of muscle there is. On 7:45 of the video, you see some neck/shoulder pieces, that seem to picture additional smaller wings around the neck area. Small, short wings like this, together with low placement of wings that would only function in forward leaning position support some sort of glide-flying behaviour.

      I seriously appreciate the effort of thinking out of the box. Last 15 years every god damn dragon and drake has become just another angel with bat wings or a typical lizard-bat. Let angels keep their wings at their shoulders, I want my dragonkin as scary as dozen raptors in your kitchen, with your daughter.

    4. Sebastien Parent on

      Please guy, also keep in mind that this is a concept art. If you go back on some of the great graphic games of our time and look at the concept art, you would be amazed how bad some of them looks. The guy isn't even founded yet. It won't be in Alpha for another 7 months at least. Most of the graphic polish actually come between Alpha and Beta. Don't Panic.

    5. Missing avatar

      Negura on

      I do agree with what's been said below. I've not been positively impressed with most of the concept art. Sure, I can write it off due to any of the many given reasons, but that does not make it succesful either.

      The quantity is not problem, although there isn't a lot of it and that's ok, it's the quality.

      It would be nice to see better concept art, but I think what will make or break the next days is the follow-ups regarding the actual RVR, classes, races, combat etc. The stuff that matters.

    6. Missing avatar

      Dan Biela on

      @Gronar Lack of artistic skill or maturity? I'm not sure if you're aware of what concept art is, but it's not supposed to be finished product by a long shot. I will agree that some of the concept art they have shone is pretty rough, but a lot of what they have is very well done for it's purpose - to convey a visual idea in a basic manner. Remember as well that this isn't a massive studio that has been working on this project with funding for years. I think your expectations are a little high for where these people are at on the journey of making this game a reality.

    7. Missing avatar

      Gronar on

      I will be blunt.
      The art shown so far lacks artistic maturity, creativity or skill. I'm disappointed to say the least.
      I know things can improve or change while moving trough production, but the role of concept art should be the inspiring one and push everyone creatively, not the other way around.
      I can't help it but to think of the low quality art found on Elfwood gallery.
      Anyhow, I acknowledge all said might sound harsh, but I believe this issue is in dire need to be addressed.
      Thank you.

    8. Missing avatar

      sharrakor on

      I agree, there should be some stealthers in the game. I too would be upset if none are included. I could understand if they are not in the initial version, but IMO they should be a serious "to do" item.

    9. Missing avatar

      Harold Stormer on

      I will be a sorely upset backer if there is no stealth in this game. Nothing better than playing an assassin.

    10. Josef on

      A very beautiful and unique race. I wouldn't put the wings there, but meh.

      I am glad to see you are thinking outside the box.

    11. Missing avatar

      Ihana on

      I think the wing placement fine. The overall design might look a bit too generic with wings on the back.

    12. Missing avatar

      Ronald Bell on

      @Alex Howard. Being a supportive boss is great. You can say, "That's a great start!" The other half of being a great boss and team leader is having the keenness of eye to weed out what doesn't make sense and help shape it into what does. Your comment about gnomes is a non sequitur. By all means explore new terrain. Like One-Eyed Jack says, start them correctly high, tuck them in, and let them flare out. Doesn't take much adjustment. And it's not as silly. You can explore new ground without doing things that don't work. It's still a shallow attempt to give a whole race a skirt, but at least it makes a bit of sense. I subscribe to Kurosawa's immaculate reality even in science fiction and fantasy. If you need wings, you've made the statement that your creature uses physics to fly. Physical laws either apply or are explicitly abrogated. If you use magic to fly, that's fine too. In that case, you might not need wings. Either one is okay. Think through every detail though. Do everything for a reason. It pays off. I'm tired of orcs and goblins too, for what it's worth.

    13. Alex Howard on

      @ Ronald Bell Come on man this is all about being original think, he walks by and sees this and makes it a character...i wish i had a boss like that who actually gives a damn about what the people do, not only that it could be used for a "hover" type flight to get over smaller object as rough terrain and not so much as to "take flight" i like it, brings me back to when everything wasnt so cookie cutter IE you get goblins we get gnomes. Keep up the good work guys!!!!

    14. Missing avatar

      One-Eyed Jack on

      The wings are tucked against the body and attached higher. They're just flaring out at the waist.

    15. Missing avatar

      Ronald Bell on

      Wings don't go there. Seriously. It's "unique" but not in a good way. No animal has ever put wings there because it doesn't work. Think of where the center of gravity is. Wanting to have a faux skirt isn't enough reason to do this. Please rethink.

    16. Mel A on

      New race looks interesting. I'll play one, at least to try it out. Very much looking forward to continued development. This is making time move more slowly!

    17. Nanulak on

      From Anglo-Saxon literature we can garner information from the examination of Grendel’s severed arm and his mother’s head. And from the descriptions we can deduce that this was a scaly skinned hard clawed creature.
      “…Every nail, claw-scale and spur, every spike and welt on the hand of that heathen brute was like barbed steel. Everybody said there was no honed iron hard enough to pierce him through, no time proofed blade that could cut his brutal blood caked claw…”
      “…going as far as stating that Grendel could easily have been a bipedal dragon…”
      From this information it seems to me that the St’rm may be the ancestors of this infamous Grendel and his mother. And if this is so, then it appears the St’rm may be dragonkin.

    18. Missing avatar

      Kaledor on

      So at work, yes we talk about CU, we really like to know if there is collision detection or not... we really enjoy the tank walls from WAR! :)

    19. Patrick T. Marasco on

      I like the calm relaxed Mark!

      The concept art for the new race is killer! Holy cow she is one scarry race and I like that she is different from anything else I've seen in MMO's.

    20. Missing avatar

      Christian on

      Awesome race, even when i will never play such a THING :)

      Hope they won´t be Viking because i want to slay these beasts

      Keep going and greetings to the art designer who created this one :)

    21. Etienne Ramstein on

      Looking forward to the buttwings size slider in character creation screen :p joke aside, great work on the animation, there is something intense in it.

    22. Tokk TenTonHammer on

      I like the mix of beauty and cruelness in her face.

      A race called St'rm must be a V'k'ng, like Th'nd'r and L'ghtn'ng.
      Right? =]

      However, i like it. Amazing work!

    23. Missing avatar

      Solst on

      As already stated, I really liked the concept art and was blown away by the amount of detail already in the animation demo. I think I have figured out what drew me to them so quickly. If any of you are Robert Jordan / WoT fans, think about the Draghkar :) How about some similar racial ability where the "crooning/song" was almost a "mez" to allow the player to get close and engage.

      Just a thought .... :)

    24. SMasterson on

      Orangu: "Ass wings!!!!!!"

      LOL. Yes...devs...what is up with the wings on the butt? lmao

    25. Jerome on

      Seems like they could fit the bill as Merrow...Selkies...Murigen / Morgens / Mari-Morgans ...

    26. Missing avatar

      Jeremy Malasics on

      This new race is very interesting. I also wonder how the wings will affect armor/weapons, but other than that I really like this new race.

      Can't wait for those big updates =)

    27. Missing avatar

      Orangu on

      Ass wings!!!!!!

    28. Chad Stovern on

      Great update; I loved the walk–cycle animation. You certainly have a talented team in CSE that seems to be able to crank out quality work very fast & efficiently.

      Looking forward to your future "larger" updates as well. ^_^

    29. Missing avatar

      Chris Norton on

      Well I definitely like the model and would love to see it incorporated either as a playable race or as an NPC in the depths (maybe one of those bosses?). More to the point of development and artistic freedom, I think it would open a lot of doors if they did consider beings like these to have been magically twisted, as it gives them creative license to rethink some classic (but perhaps less beloved) mythological figures, in light of their new take on these worlds.

      I think a lot of people would be upset if they put some sort of 'dragon corruption' on a race like elves or dwarves, but putting it on lesser loved mythological races found in the appropriate lore could be a compelling way to merge the lore we know with the lore they're creating.

    30. Missing avatar

      Christian Jurczyk on


      Robobot raises many valid points regarding the interaction of non-standard appendages. Those moving wings might make everything harder and / or need extra treatment.

      As long as they make it work there should not be problem. We are also not forced to play the St'rm so everything seems to be okay - the design seems to be pretty polarizing. You either love it or hate it.

    31. Missing avatar

      Chris Norton on

      @Blake - I agree that the aesthetics of the model are pleasing as they are currently, I just wonder how the wing/tail structure would interact with armor/weapons (assuming it's a playable race rather than an NPC from something like the depths, of course).

    32. Missing avatar

      Chris Norton on

      @Christian Jurczyk - I was intentionally trying not to go the route of evolution which was the whole point of mentioning things like magical races being twisted by the magic of the dragons when they shattered the veil. It was a magical out of biological evolution. The game does have magic after all, suspension of disbelief is expected.

      However, insofar as evolution is concerned, it may be true that most creatures do use their back and shoulders for flight (hence the assertion that most dragons are depicted with either wings for forelegs or with their wings attached slightly below the shoulder, usually attached to the shoulder blade), but once those appendages are no longer used for flight and become useless biological appendages, they would likely evolve away from prominent positioning on something like the shoulder. This would be especially true in this case given the need of having rotational motion/freedom in the shoulder of a bipedal humanoid.

      All that said, I still don't think that we need to be looking for a biological/evolutionary reason for this, rather than a magical mutation reason for it. I simply think that aesthetically, particularly in the case of interacting with armor, the wings on the upper small of the back would just work better in general and would be less aesthetically jarring for the people who are looking at things from an evolutionary perspective (we all know there will be some people who do).

    33. Vervacious on

      Love the placement of the wings. Sort of has that flamingo feel to it. I like that its different from any other race concept out there. Very creative. Risky, yes, but that's what makes this project so cool.

      She's very draconic, dark, deeply-rooted in nature, but distorted, possibly due to the effect of the piercing of the veil.

      It seems like she should be able to pick you up and just squeeze the life out of you with her wings. That would be a very cool ability for St'rm.

    34. Blake McCracken on

      Keep the wings where they are, it has a fresh look and the model looks amazing. Good Job.

    35. Missing avatar

      DACLIN Maxime on

      Great stack of empty empty beers behind your desks :D

    36. Missing avatar

      Robobot on

      This is interesting but does it make sense to do it?

      For instance, how does gear come in to play?
      Maybe everyone is ok with clipping and wings that just seem to tear through whatever armor the character is wearing but maybe not. Do you want all usable weapons to just rest on the hip and cut through the b'wing, I would look at the rest of the species that are planned and ask if they are going to share armor models/skins. If they are going to share, I would ask if any decisions are being made that might affect that plan or standards. Additionally I would ask myself and the team “Are we going to make use of these appendages or do we really just like the idea of skirt made of dragon wings? If it’s dragon wing dresses/capes there are a ton of ways to make that work and still be really cool. If it’s make use of them..there is a lot of decisions to be made

      I agree that this looks cool but so do bigwheels. Just because you CAN add bigwheels to a game, should you? Especially if that bigwheel may not appear to have the same detail and polish level as the rest of the game/races. That bigwheel also comes with a ton of expectation and managing that is important.

      On the dev side, you are going to need more anim time or animators to support things that deviate from your base or pool of shared assets. If you start creating oneoff skels you start increasing your costs and need to make some serious commitments to that decision. There is so much to think about when adding things like this.

      I am sure your animator is swimming in a sea of anim needs like special knock, mezz, fall, run, movement -10 directions, hit reacts, do we have swim, is there levitate/magic hold. The list goes on and on. Your character artists might have questions like, do we share all parts, do we create unique parts, are their options for the wings, how many options..

      I am not assuming that you haven’t thought of all these things and more. Part of development, maybe the best part, is freedom to make some leaps towards larger goals. Some of the best things in games and from your Mythic have likely come from designs and decisions that started from “wouldn’t it be cool if…”

      Keep up the good work…

    37. Dennis Wynjadal on

      Now, I do like the idea of a Draconic race, (that's what it looks like to me).
      But my brain can't help to think in the lines "what use are those "wings" on her behind?"

      Although the 3D model looks quite cool, I'd rather see the wings starting about her shoulder blades.
      I'm guessing (and hoping) this race is meant for TDD?

      About the concerns if this project will make the funding.. Well I feel it too. But I think as soon as classes and general game play starts getting revealed it will boost the amount of founders.

      Right now I think its not enough concrete "stuff" to go on for a lot of people to start backing it.

    38. Lance Shannon on

      First off, enjoying the HELL out of you guys keeping in contact with your backers as often as you have been. One thing that I always enjoyed when Mark was involved with Mythic was the superb in game customer service that took a SERIOUS nose dive after Electronic Arts got involved. Here's to hoping that debacle is NOT repeated.

      As to the character render for St'rm. I am liking it quite a bit, but as many others have said, the wing placement is something I am on the fence about. I'd probably need to see more than just a walk render to "get" what kind of functionality the wings would have, say in a battle scenario or falling, etc.

      Other than that, keep doing what your doing, it IS working. Oh, and by the way, thanks for the nod to Canada with the moose on the sill. Nice to see some game companies giving it up for the "other" North Americans :) Peace.

    39. Missing avatar

      Christian Jurczyk on


      Evolution and dragons. Please, don't go there. ^_^

      Except for insects and the like most flying creatures use their powerful back and chest muscles and their arms to move the wings.

      That said - it is still a fantasy game. Personally I just find the position of the wings not really appealing. They seem somehow useless.

    40. NightAngel on

      Love the race design. I think it would fit in the TDD side very well. I have read some of the comments about the wings. Artistically, I like them the way they are presented but the idea with moving them more to the small of the back would be good too. Either way I would play one. :)

    41. Missing avatar

      Lemonnier Yohan on

      I love this new race. I'm waiting for the male model. But she seems to wear no armor, i'm curious to know how armor will fit on this race.

    42. Missing avatar

      Joe Huber on

      I love the new race. As with many other commenters not sure about the wings. I can as a few have said see how they would have evolved like that.

    43. BarliWeiss on

      The model is pretty sweet looking. I do agree with some of the comments about wing placement. They should be higher up closer to the shoulders, but they still can hang low as they do. They could even be fused to the back, but make it protruding so you can see a bit of bone/definition of what used to be wing.

    44. Missing avatar

      Chris Norton on

      @ Xavier - I don't really disagree with your assertions about the break with biological evolution the wings would indicate - they would be much more compelling from that perspective on the small of the back. Remember that in a lot of imagery where a dragon's forelegs aren't also its wings - like a bat - they are usually in the lower portion of the upper back, just below the shoulder joint, which, as the wings are used less and less, could easily be seen to move from the prominent upper back to the lower back, allowing for a more pronounced musculature to evolve around the shoulders, which would coincide with a bipedal humanoid who uses their arms for more than walking.

      All that said, you also have to remember that there has to be a certain suspension of belief allowed when incorporating things like magic. I would have to assume that the shattering of the veil would have an equivalent impact on their world as it did on ours - a cataclysmic one that perhaps only left the dragons unscathed. If the magic of the dragons was that strong, then it's feasible that in expending enough of it to shatter the veil they could have easily twisted the bodies of some of the other magical beings behind the veil in a way that is contrary to our standard assumptions regarding evolution.

    45. xavier muylaert on

      @ Hellraiser, ok, maybe I overstated the 'cancel' a bit. at least i hope the arthurians will stick to the human history lore. in DAoC i started with the arthurians because they were the most 'human' and i could relate best to that.

      i like swords and sorcery more than i like (weird) fantasy. i would like to see some concept art about something that i could identify as 'a' Parcival or Merlin more i guess as far as player races/classes go.

      about the inconnu. They seem very normal for humanoids that have gone underground for 10.000's of years, from an evolutionary perspective. magic could even accelerate those 10.000's of years to a handful of generations. a bit like the adaptations/warping that 'golum' in lotr underwent. every change between a humanoid 'most recent common ancestor with us' to the inconnu looks like a functional adaptation to underground life.

      the minotaurs are a feature in a lot of human folklore and as a result i didn't consider them 'weird' either.

      those wings on the but on the other hand seem way to dysfunctional and impractical to contribute anything to survival odds. a peacock's or bird of paradise's tail serves an important display function for sexual selection and for the rest is a major handicap that is extremely impractical. at least the antlers of a stag or the horns of most other living things serves also as a fighting tool, not just something that handicaps the thing and is more likely to get it killed than make it survive during a fight.

    46. Mark Knapp on

      I love the fact that you are letting the art team really be creative and are not tying their hands and forcing them into specific peg holes. The design is really cool for this race and I can definitely see how a "dragonkin" race could end up in this world considering the dragons are the root cause of the "piercing" of the vale.
      The design really makes a lot of sense too. Typically a dragons wings are above their massive hind legs with a large sweeping tale balancing their weight distribution. As this race adapted to a more "humanistic" life: the tale has shrunk back and the legs have adapted to more of a biped style, this would make the wing placement appropriate. I can see how the dragon would look at the human clothing and then adapt their wings and scales to mimic the clothing. I could also see the wings being much smaller and a larger tail as well Maybe have these be a slider? or a difference between the male and female?
      In any case, it's really great to see the team really pushing the envelope of creativity. I don't think this race was an effort to "push kickstarter sales" like some do. I just see it as the team seeing this concept art, thinking it was awesome, and running with it. This is how great things are made.

    47. Missing avatar

      Chris Norton on

      I think that the model and its movement are both pretty exceptional, I think from an evolutionary standpoint it would make more sense if the wings were on the small of her back if we are assuming that this is a humanoid that has evolved from a dragon. So I think that the model is great, the concept is interesting, and the rendering was well done, especially if we are suspending belief in evolutionary biology (which I have no problem doing considering dragons and magic).

      That said, this race, as it is, does not fit into the mythos of any of the tree realms from what I've read (although there may be some lore on humanoid dragonspawn that I'm not aware of). However, on the other hand, if we treat this like a magical humanoid (such as an elf) from beyond the veil, whose body was twisted/deformed as the dragons pierced the veil, then it could fit into the lore nicely and it could give the artists a bit of creative license in regards to the typical races seen in fantasy worlds. Of course, whether or not CSE would want to do this with the most beloved magical humanoid races is up to them, as it might alienate some people who love the lore and the look that surrounds the mythology and aesthetic of some of those races, and this would be a fundamental break from those things. That said, I'm certain if CSE found some less beloved humanoid creatures, like kobolds, innconu, charr, valkyns, etc. and gave each realm a "dragon twisted" version of that race, then I think that it would not only draw from the mythos, but it would also establish a backstory that is more rich and engaging, in that we see familiar things twisted by the power of the dragons.

    48. Missing avatar

      Phillip Flores on

      Love the model. The wings do seem a little low but aside that rocking model. The fact this isn't typical lore and CSE is going for a darker theme, I think this model fits right for the direction.