by Night Trap, LLC
Keep the spirits up! Quitters never win and winners never quit
I had a few concerns regarding the way this was done:
1) $25 shipping cost for one disc. Almost every other project that is disc-based in its rewards has this anywhere from 5-10, so I'm not sure where the figure for added shipping was taken from, to cost more than the actual pledged amount!
2) Did it need to be disc-based? It seems the larger portion of the projected allocation of funds was to physical rewards; if you focused on digital release, and a more limited print-run of only a specific format of disc (perhaps PC/Mac) then you would surely require much less to produce this, no? A lower goal is easier to attain, and people might be more drawn to it if they see the total as more likely to be hit - at least, that's how the kickstarter people I know operate.
3) Confusing number of pledge levels. The different formats could have been arranged via a survey at the end. Not the biggest problem in the world, but it was a bit daunting!
4) No word out there. I accidentally stumbled upon this Kickstarter project while browsing; it took a minute to sink in! I was surprised there wasn't more word out there about this.
I never got a chance to play the original, but have heard fables of it; this game is a large part of gaming history, and it would be a shame for it to end here. I really hope you recalculate things, and have another go at funding - I would pledge again in a heartbeat!
We're certainly not quitting; just a bit of introspection.
As for the $25 international shipping, that's what the USPS charges for a small International package. Obviously we have no control over that, and the alternatives (DSL, FedEx, UPS) were even more expensive...
Your promo video is poor, lacking info on how this game will be accomplished, what an updated version would look like and how the original assets would be reprocessed. Worse still, your talking heads seem very tepid in their own interest to see Night Trap remade. Make a new video and contact me for help if necessary. Just a little tough love here, I'm a backer and want you to succeed.
Sorry, it might be my lack of knowledge in shipping and such, but I'm getting a Kickstarter-funded board game shipped to the UK from the US for a $15 add-on to the pledge level; are they giving me discounted shipping then? I feel bad now, would've upped my pledge there
Again, I would like to see this made, meant no disrespect in my lengthy garbled comment; was just giving what I saw as feedback. It may be wrong (it probably is, as you can guess from some of my language used I can be a bit 'derpy'), but if these are conclusions I came to, however invalid, chances are others also reached these same thoughts!
A few things work against you, 1) Night trap wasn't a super popular game (it was released on consoles that were too expensive or didn't sell well) so not many people know of it. 2) It was poorly rated so those who have heard of it but not played it will think it is bad. 3) the reward tiers are very confusing.
What you really need in the promo video is the play up what the game was, why it is worth relaunching and what can people expect other than a rom ported to PC. Keep in mind how many backers you will need for 330,000 dollars if the game is only 20 bucks a copy, you would need 16,500 people. That is a huge about for an obscure title. Also where is that money going to? Are you guys building it from scratch and refilming the game as well? Because it sounds like you need 330,000 just to update the old game to work on the new platforms and manufacture it. If you consider Double Fine only needed 400,000 to make and original title, this makes your project seem completely overpriced. So someone might see that and go this must be a Scam. So on the front page you really should break down where the money is going and why.
Unfortunately, I think that as long as gamers and journalists will continue to see interactive movies as "video games that try to resemble movies" and not movies that share some codes with video games, the situation will be stuck. The difference between the two approaches is subtle but crucial because interactive movies can't compete with video games in terms of gameplay. Indeed, most of the fun lies in their unique atmoshpere. CG images, especialy when they're calculated in real time, can't offer the same experience than live action footage. Imho...
Honestly I just think you are asking for too much money
sad. i really want that this project will be a success. but, like i mentioned in earlier comments from me, i think, the interesting rewards are far to expensive. but if you will do another round of crowdfunding, i will back again. i liked and like your fmw games very much.
My interest is more as a horror fan – I’m not much of a gamer, but the filmed video game element seems interesting to me.
I didn’t think that your levels are confusing, but I know from my brother who is a huge video gamer that the world of gaming is currently all over the place, with some folks only interested in video games that push the extremes of their home system, to people that just want games that are available on their phone as an app. Video games are a huge business, but to get the attention of that audience and not get raked over the coals regularly is hard to do. Even with successful campaigns, like the one for Project Eternity, there are tons of people constantly complaining about every little thing.
Suggestions: do your Kickstarter again if it fails this time, but modify the tiers to be crystal clear, and also be clear about what it is that the game is about. Push to retro gamer sites and to horror fans.
As one of the biggest proponents of Night Trap in my podcasts (both this project and the original game) over the course of the last 15+ years, I might be able to shed some light on this.
People don't understand what Night Trap represents in the historical record of video gaming. It's known as a "crappy, cheesy FMV game" .. one that was best left forgotten in the 90s.
Those that hated it then? Still hate it now. Those that loved it? The cursed the difficulty and the fact that you can't enjoy all the game has to offer if you are actually PLAYING it.
To a lot of people, FMV should be a four letter word.
So - who wants to see it again?
The way I look at it; you need a way to "fix" it so that the people that hated it are interested and the people who loved it (but didn't) have a reason to come back.
... and you need to find a way to get people that have no idea WTF it is ... to care enough to potentially back the project.
I have ideas. You know where to reach me :) if you want them, they are yours.
I hate to say it but I think you guys really botched the Kickstarter, especially early on.
I think these type of projects get most of their attention really early and then have a second wind of sorts near the end and the usual charts showing this seem to support this.
My personal opinion is that if you want this to become a reality, you should get everything in line and run another kickstarter and I would suggest the following changes:
1. Make the project look as professional as possible.
To begin with there wasn't a lot of clear info, visual aids or explanation about the project and what it's goals were. The info is a lot better now, but the people who were driving by already had the project past them.
I would take what you currently have and try to improve it even further, ditch the current video and have the 4 people working on the project talk about it and answer some of the frequently asked questions, explaining what you guys are planning on doing with this project, why and why it's important.
2. Change the way the rewards are structured
They are a complete mess and someone who isn't super interested in the project isn;t going to read them all. They are largely redundant and it deters people from even reading them in my opinion.
The fact everything is listed 4 times, once for each platform is a pretty big issue IMO. I would eliminate that and just put one listing each for the platform of your choice. I would also highly consider removing the A La Carte options. Also maybe add a Physical/Digital combo for maybe $30 or so.
3. Some of the higher end rewards are too expensive.
Stuff like the special thanks and associate producer are obscenely expensive and literally cost you guys nothing extra. I would figure out a price point for the "Special Thanks Credit" probably somewhere around the $100-$150 range and have everything above it include it. I'd drop Associate Producer to $1-2k or so and make it unlimited rather than just 4 people.
I'd also consider lowering the price for the note and the LE box.
4. Do what you can to get the word out more
Doing stuff like press releases and interviews is kind of hit or miss, but aside from that if you go after people who have decent followings on Youtube and such and get them to plug the project you're likely to get a lot more buzz easier. If you contacted someone like PewDiePie, sent him a copy of the old game, had him play it and mention the project and plug it you could likely get a ton of extra support as he has 30 Million viewers. There are a ton of popular lets players/game critics on youtube and such, if you reached out to them and got their support it could go a long way.
Anyway that ended up being a lot longer than I expect it to, anyway I hope this gives you guys some stuff to consider and good luck with the next shot.
Sad to see it so far from it's goal,been a fan of all the DP titles still own most of the 32xcd/sat versions. NT and Corpse Killer were my favs.
Well since this is an open platform and you are seeking opinions; without being too insulting the project honestly came across as kind of amateurish.
The launch without any digital tiers at first was a ridiculously silly move and one that I still find quite baffling and don't quite understand the reasoning behind. You can't honestly come onto an international platform like Kickstarter and assume everyone is 'Murican. As others have said the fact that shipping for the disc was more than the game itself right there and then would drive most folk away..
Secondly the absurd amount of tiers you have here for the same thing. I read in the Faq that you chose this on purpose - but honestly it's just a clusterfuck. There's a reason 99.99% of other projects have the straight up multi platform tiers at each price point and then send out a survey/backerkit to receive data on the preferred platform.
Thirdly the goal to me seems a tad high for a recreation of an FMV game. As far as I could gather from the front page, all you were doing is literally transferring the existing FMV's into a higher format - and not actually filming more footage/recreating the footage. (correct me if I'm wrong) By comparison something like Tesla Effect was asking for a bit more than this but was creating an entire game from scratch.
And lastly... um... IMO night trap is a joke game that people make digs at and don't take seriously. Sorry but I was actually here for the novelty value and the lulz. You know - the concept that something is so bad that it's good and all that? I guess it's just too old that a lot of folk don't have the cheesy nostalgia and just see it being bad because it's bad. It's not like this one was overly popular and created a cult following like some of the other multi-hundred thousand projects we've seen. Sorry.
I think having a really confusing reward structure with no digital options probably killed it from the start. Even though you apparently added digital options it seems to have been too late. Unless you've got really good connections, bouncing back from a bad start isn't really doable... since most of the video game websites who write about you are going to write one article at the start going "wow this kickstarter setup looks weird, there's no digital options and expensive international shipping" and they're not going to write a second article when you add digital options.
With regards to your comments on PR... seriously, TV and print? Do those even matter for video game kickstarters in 2014?
And I guess there's also the issue of the shipping. Yes I know you've said that's what shipping costs you internationally, but that doesn't fit with what every other kickstarter's physical reward shipping costs look like.
I dunno, it's like you didn't even do your research on how other video game kickstarters have worked.
I figure a purely digital release (just on PC/Mac, don't think about physical boxes or console releases until you know you can afford them) might work, even as a relaunched kickstarter, but make sure you've got PR stuff lined up. And I don't mean TV or print, I mean gaming websites.
I really want to this happen, either with this KS or another one you restart.
I backed from the beginning, despite the International shipping rate (UK here) as I am a fan of the game and thought it would be cool to play it again.
I think - as others have said - there was confusion at the start over the platforms, using terms 'PlayStation' and 'Xbox', made it sound ultra dodgy and almost like the game was simply a DVD with branching or something! Further to this, I actually enquired about Trophy support on PS3 (a requirement, with two options), and the answer I got was quite vague.. almost like you weren't entirely sure what I was talking about.
If you are going to restart it I will definitely back it again, but I would like to see the options stripped right back. Also, if you are going to support PS3, 360 and Wii U, you should consider PlayStation 4 and Xbox One at the same time. There are 16m (10m PS4, 6m Xbox One) machines out there combined now, you shouldn't be ignoring that audience.
Also, it would be nice that even the standard package came with all the extra interviews, the blooper footage you must have, test footage, the pilot film you made before Night Trap and so on. Really nail a special package together that celebrates the game.
Finally, show the game! I want to see what it looks like in 1080p with the game UI running. Even if you haven't finalised it yet, there must be mockups that your artists have done :) Show 'em!
The only KS project I backed that didn't propose any physical copy was largely criticized - a lot of backers are (nostaligic) collectors who want a (signed) box. So, if there is a second attempt, maybe it would be good to keep at least one pledge level for a dvd-rom - I know that I would buy the (very expensive) limited boxset if it was the only way to get a physical copy fo Night Trap Revamped.
There isn't much more to say than whats been said, I think its pretty clear. I'll add that you guys had some bad luck in that a recent successfully backed game went belly up before it was finished and and the backers got porked. This spooked a lot of people and everyone was a little wary to drop cash willy-nilly on kickstarter games, especially due to the seemingly high price goal. I don't know anything about what goes in to these games or what it would cost to make it, but at a glance to someone being careful your $ goal seems pretty high. I think this # could have come way down if you weren't targeting "Xbox" and "Playstation". A few popular podcasts I listen to didn't have much good to say about this kickstarter, one just calling it a flat out scam. I had faith though, I posted about the kickstarter in a sizable Sega group on Facebook, a couple people bashed it and the moderator actually pulled my post from the group because he didn't like the sound of it.
Personally the idea of this game gives me all sorts of nostalgia fuzzies. I'd love to play again in the clearest video possible. If you start again I would back. If you do decide to try again, please regard what a lot of people in these comments said, I agree with most of it
Yeah personally if this Kickstarter didn't have a physical release I wouldn't even consider backing it. With this type of project I think you really need both.
Tom, James, and the rest of the Revamped folks: I hope you take this as the constructive criticism it is meant to be, and that you can regroup next year and launch another campaign with success. Here are some thoughts for when you try this again:
- The reward tiers were too confusing, which others have pointed out; let the user pick their platform after the game is finished. Also, keep the number of tiers reasonable, like 10 or less, to avoid confusion.
- Don't focus on TV and print media *at all*. Kickstarter campaigns are learned about nearly 100% from social media: Blogs, Facebook posts, Twitter, etc. Next time, I would try to contact as many classic gaming blogs and youtube channels as possible and seed those first.
- Mobile devices should be the primary deliverable (ie. iphone/ipad, android phone/tablet). Having convenient access to the game, with a touchscreen interface, is the most appropriate delivery vehicle for an FMV game. You can work on other platforms too, but you lost a lot of potential backers by ignoring the world's largest gaming platform (ie. casual).
I look forward to your next attempt, as I enjoyed your FMV games in the 1990s.
Reiterating what others have said, I think that not only were your tiers initially really confusing, but also you really didn't explain what the game was very easily.
I honestly never even knew this existed, and stumbled upon it by complet accident while searching for a different Kickstarter project. I'm a huge Night Trap fan, and would have backed it even sooner had I known about it.
Sincere thanks for all the comments and suggestions...
The initial sour reaction made it hard to un-ring the bell, but I'm happy that you guys aren't going to give up. I'm a huge Digital Pictures fan and would love to see HD Night Trap someday.
I think the passion for the project and the focus come through when you go through all of the material, but it needs to hit strong for just casual viewers. Just a thought, there's a lot of rumble about "Five Nights at Freddy's" and its similarity to Night Trap. Maybe that could be leveraged?
I think a new "ReVamped" logo is needed as well as concept art and at very least a mock up of the game running. Would there be a way of using the Digital Pictures name as many folks know it and it would lend authenticity to the kickstarter. I'm old school and prefer discs to digital (A DP FMV box set would be great) but for cost and ease of delivery the likes of steam/psn/live are the norm today. Digital should get the $330,000 target down as first impression was that was way to high. Disc versions should be either dropped or set as a very limited top tier award as only us original fans are the likely buyers. Maybe concentrate on PC first then add stretch goals to cover the other versions. Having 50 rewards is confusing, this should be 15 max. Beta tester is a cool reward for fans yet at no extra cost, more rewards like this and the digital copies of scripts and senate hearings files are great. (Watched the 2+ hours of the senate hearings, I thought our UK politicians were bad but those guys had no clue about games!)
I had hope from the start but ill continue to tell people about this
In my opinion, the key issue was that there was no Digital option available from the start. I remember emailing you guys when the campaign first started and you replied saying there would not be a digital version.
When I checked back here by chance, I saw you added one. Why did you not get back to me and let me know? Why didn't you let EVERYONE know? Digital is over 80% of all PC purchases now. Physical media is nearly dead.
I backed it now there is a Digital option, but I don't think many of those 4 million people came back to check if you added it or not.
When I first watched the Kickstarter video for this, I was like "yeah, Night Trap, I really loved that game back in the day". But I didn't back it. Then I watched Garrett Gilchrist's Remake Trailer. https://www.youtube.com/watch…
After that, I backed pretty much immediately. The difference? This trailer reminded me WHY I loved this game. It brought back memories of all the cheesy goodness, hours upon hours of playing that game in my younger days, my friends and I screaming at the screen "LIVING ROOM! NO! NO! BACK HALL!"
It tugged my nostalgia strings and even better had one of the most memorable actors from the game giving an endorsement (though I loved every one of the cast!). That was a spectacular video.
As a bonus, if you had never seen the game before, this would have been a crash course in what it's all about. My daughters (who have never played this game) thought it looked cool.
When you re-launch (and I hope you do), as others have said:
Get new people excited in the game.
Rework the tiers to make them clear and simple.
And of course, find ways to make the old fans remember not just that the game was fun but why it was.
I paid a dollar just to have my thoughts on this:
The target amount was too high $330,000, the lack of transparency made me weary of investment and the response to the transparency made me doubt it even more!
My recommendation would be to release it as a Flash game. I knocked up Road Avenger in Flash MX 2004 using streaming tech from ten years ago in an evening! So I know streaming games of an FMV nature are perfectly feasible.
Like Matt I just backed this project just to give you my thoughts.
The first one is that this update is the perfect exemple of everything you've done wrong with this campaign: I've been following this kickstarter campaign from day 1, and from the first few hours the way you communicated made me question your ability to deliver on the project.
People are right to say the funding goal was way too high to begin with and the first rewards offered were not what is expected from this type of campaign.
Let's talk about communication and PR for a second: a prospective backer wants to feel comfortable that his pledge will go towards the development of the project and that the team behind the project is competent.
At every turn the Night Trap team has showcased its complete disconnect with today's video game marketplace and the old school/nostalgia video game marketplace: not offering digital downloads at the start was the tip of iceberg, but talking more about press releases, trademarks, intellectual property rights and even here mentioning print and tv media is just completely anachronic with how your audience gets information.
Let's be clear; we want the money to go the development of the game; not for you to spend money on intellectual property rights and not on PR, focus groups, marketing research, etc. This is not what crowdfunding is about.
And let's talk about that catastrophic Kotaku interview where not only the answers given to very basic game development questions made it sounds like you guys have no experience whatsoever in making games; furthermore, when several media outlets asked designers who worked on AAA games about some of your comments on technical things; you dismissed their observations in a rude manner instead of listening to the viewpoints of these industry experts.
That interview was published in the first week of the campaign and was picked by all the major video gaming media outlets. Night Trap is part of the video game history and there was huge interest in this campaign, but YOU guys blew it!
The bottom line is the Night Trap portrayed itself has a team of legacy media professionals (film/tv) who, once upon a time, made an interactive movie and who have a very limited knowledge in the current video game development cycle and a team of people who tried to surf on the crowdfunding buzz and nostalgia to make a quick buck.
Think about it; most people who want an HD version of Night Trap are NOT the ones who owned the game; in the 90s there was game scarcity and a lot of us who grew up in that decade couldn't find the game in a store nearby. The people the most interested in an HD version are the ones who heard about it, have seen trailers, but never got a chance to play the game when it came out. So when you're talking about the 850,000 who bought Night Trap in the 90s, you're exhibiting a lack of knowledge of your marketing target.
Wasting money on a comscore analysis is another proof of what I stated earlier that the lack of expertise exhibited by this team is what drove people away.
Maybe if the comments section wasn't reserved to backers you could have had feedback from people interested, instead you alienated a lot of prospective backers by not allowing them to tell you what they were expecting from you; why paying for a Comscore analysis when all the feedback you need is free on so many social platforms.
25 tweets in 30 days! No engagement whatsoever with people who tweeted at you.
Not even a thank you to people who tweeted about the project!
We're in 2014 and you're talking about the lack of print and tv media as a cause of the failure of your campaign? what about the fact that you completely ignored the marketing tools that can bring the most ROI???
I really wish this campaign was a success that in a few months a lot of people could enjoy Night Trap, but sadly it won't be the case.